U.S. Foreign Policy

[Doc]

Agree, Trump man for the job .. Trump said he goin to leave that barn to Russians and Iranians to clean it up .. W. Bush did the same .. when W.Bush realized he was coned by Neocons, handed Mesopotamia to Ahmadinejat, declared "mission accomplished" packed and left .. Trump no dummy, he no lettin conin by Neocon, he will handover that barn to Russian and Iran from start.
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Unfortunately obama is a neocon by himself, that space may be glowing before Trump gets in.

Well at the very least we now know how a community organizer does foreign policy.

[Heracleum Persicum]

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McCain, Garahm, Lieberman, Necons have now their "no-fly-zone", happy ? ?

4800 meters per second .. Range now covers at least three-quarters of Syrian territory, a huge part of Turkey, all of Lebanon, Cyprus and half of Israel (limiting Israel's action) .. any plane flying in that space in danger of being shot down if the Russian General decides so

McCain, heeeeeeelp

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Az, can you tell me, are you more on Turkey side or Russia side.

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Solidly on Russian side, not for liking Russia, but disliking Turkey.

For many reasons.

Turkey an "artificial state", not even a nation, only 17% of Turkey are ethnic Turks, leading to many issues.

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[Heracleum Persicum]

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But but AZ Iranians dying like flies on fly paper in Syria.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/ir ... story.html

Iranian media is revealing that scores of the country’s fighters are dying in Syria


BEIRUT — An increasing number of Iranian soldiers and militiamen appear to be dying in Syria’s civil war, and observers credit media from an unexpected country for revealing the trend:

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Of course not happy Iranian Generals dying in Syrian theatre, but that is what Generals are for.

You too should not be happy as Iranians only people in that space you can work with (and who like Americans, polls say Turks hate Americans), unless you (too) love Wahhabi and Salafi or Paki beheading Americans on TV.

We talking big picture, big stuff, making of "New Middle East", who will lead it, who will disappear as a nation, new borders etc, in that context a few Generals dying here and there not even a footnote.

Concentrate and comment on the big picture, please

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[Heracleum Persicum]

CUlpq3BUkAADZSu.png (76.13 KiB) Viewed 2018 times

[Heracleum Persicum]

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More Cash Than "Oil & Gas"

copper and lead and higher-priced rare earth elements could be worth “much more” than the nation’s oil industry revenue

37 billion metric tons of minerals valued at $700 billion were discovered in Iran from exploration work at 50 meters (164 feet) underground,

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[Heracleum Persicum]

sRBEbm5J9ig


Moscow releases HARD EVIDENCE that Su 24 was not in Turkey


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[Heracleum Persicum]

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Zbigniew Brzezinski
interview
U.S. and Russian interests are in fact aligned in many ways

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Today, however, despite a new round of escalating tensions between the United States and Russia, Brzezinski is far more sanguine about relations between Moscow and Washington, arguing that U.S. and Russian interests are in fact aligned in many ways. He spoke this week with Politico Magazine National Editor Michael Hirsh.


Michael Hirsh: The shoot-down of a Russian jet by Turkey represents the first time ever that a NATO ally has downed a Russian plane. Coming amid other tensions between Russia and the West, how worried are you by this?


Zbigniew Brzezinski: These tensions are serious but not fatal. In some ways, if good sense and intelligence prevail, they could even prove to be salutary, not only for dealing with a nasty regional problem but addressing the potentially more generally destructive consequences of a global system dominated by three superpowers.

MH: Why do you think this is possible?

ZB: I think that the West has reacted to the recent news from the Middle East in a calm fashion but at the same time not yielding to initial threats right after the shoot-down of the Russian plane. Moreover the Russians themselves, having taken a deep breath, also realize that to pump up the crisis is a road to nowhere. The only result could be a serious collision in which Russia would find itself in isolation. In effect, we might be on the brink of some progress among the major powers regarding not just the Turkish-Russian skirmish, but towards some salutary accommodation regarding containment of wider regional violence.

MH: Can you expand on what you mean by ‘salutary’?

ZB: I don’t think anyone thinks that escalating this dispute is worth a major conflict with truly destructive consequences. In early October, in a piece I wrote for the Financial Times, I urged an effort to engage Russia in serious negotiations about the future of the region. I think perhaps we may now be doing what needs to be done [in talks in Vienna], given the common threat inherent in the delicacy of the relations between the nuclear powers.

MH: You think there can be accommodation over Syria, even with the Russians shoring Assad up and the Americans calling for his ouster?

ZB: On Syria, there is no great national benefit for Russia in Assad remaining indefinitely in office, and there is no great national benefit for the U.S. in forcing him to quit instantly, and there is also a shared interest in avoiding a major U.S.-Russia collision. I may be naïve but I think this is one of those situations in which the stakes are not that dramatic. For a few weeks the opposite seemed potentially true in the case of Ukraine. This is why I then advocated in effect the accommodation by both us and the Russians to the idea that the Ukrainian problem should be ‘Finlandized’ insofar as the security is concerned [meaning Ukraine should not join NATO, even while remaining independent]. Now things seem to be pointing tentatively in that direction.

MH: You sound much more positive than you did in that October article, when you urged "strategic boldness," saying American credibility in the Middle East and the region itself was at stake because the Russians were striking non-ISIS targets in Syria to help Bashar al-Assad. Are you more optimistic now?

ZB: At the time the initial reports indicated that Russians were going after local forces dependent on U.S. support. We had to warn them, and I think we did. it seems to me the reaction this time was measured. Putin blew out some steam but subsequently began to talk about coping with the problem. The Turks proved to be resilient and tough but without exaggerating the collision. … So in effect the parties to this unfolding drama have become more reasonable. But I think it was quite lucky the shoot-down in Turkey was not done by us. Because Putin’s ability to digest it would be much smaller. And I am glad it was not some sort of incident in the Baltic republics, where the Russian propensity to react would be greater, the Baltic capacity to respond would be minimal, and the necessity of a forceful response by the U.S. would be self-evident.

MH: Should we be worried about Russia cooperating with China—the other great power—in opposition to the United States?

ZB: I would think not. In the short term the geostrategic interests of China favor stability over conflict. Stability permits China to steadily increase its influence in pursuing its “One Belt, One Road” program, which is a twin program to increase Chinese access to the Indian Ocean and by sea and railroad into Central Asia, and through these countries into the West, and thereby gradually and carefully shift the balance of power in Central Asia between Russia and China in favor of China. The Russians can do nothing about it. And the countries involved welcome it, with the exception at this time of Kyrgyzstan. They know their independence would disappear if they became an integral part of the Moscow-promoted Eurasian Union.…

The Chinese are very good at being neutral publicly, but privately helping one side or another. And recently they voted in favor of Ukraine becoming a member of the U.N. Security Council. That’s hardly something the Russians favored.

MH: You were known as a hawk in the Cold War. You seem to think that U.S. and Russian interests are far more aligned now.

ZB: That’s right. If the situation in the Middle East gets completely out of hand, first the recently completed long-term agreement with Iran would unravel dangerously. That could in turn create very serious problems for Israel, and there are at least some people in the Israeli leadership tempted by the military option. That could become regionally explosive. It could also induce stronger reactions from outside the region. Russia and the West share an interest in stability. As far as Assad’s “transition” is concerned there is still a lot of negotiating to be done. But I don’t think that either party thinks its vital interests are dependent on him …

MH: But some Russia experts believe Putin’s goal is to resurrect Russia’s great power status, and he’ll stop at nothing to achieve that.

ZB: It may be his approach to these issues is irrational. He obviously at first was very angry at the news. But I think he very quickly realized there would be no payoff to him for escalating unless he is very eager for a war. But in that case, with whom and with what consequences for him?

He should know ..

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[Heracleum Persicum]

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Partick J. Buchanan
Why Risk War With Russia ?

Turkey’s decision to shoot down a Russian warplane was a provocative and portentous act.

That Sukhoi Su-24, which the Turks say intruded into their air space, crashed and burned — in Syria. One of the Russian pilots was executed while parachuting to safety. A Russian rescue helicopter was destroyed by rebels using a U.S. TOW missile. A Russian marine was killed.

“A stab in the back by the accomplices of terrorists,” said Vladimir Putin of the first downing of a Russian warplane by a NATO nation in half a century. Putin has a point, as the Russians are bombing rebels in northwest Syria, some of which are linked to al-Qaeda.

As it is impossible to believe Turkish F-16 pilots would fire missiles at a Russian plane without authorization from President Tayyip Recep Erdogan, we must ask: Why did the Turkish autocrat do it?

Why is he risking a clash with Russia?

Answer: Erdogan is probably less outraged by intrusions into his air space than by Putin’s success in securing the Syrian regime of Bashar Assad, whom Erdogan detests, and by relentless Russian air strikes on Turkmen rebels seeking to overthrow Assad.

Imperiled strategic goals and ethnicity may explain Erdogan. But what does the Turkish president see down at the end of this road? And what about us? Was the U.S. government aware Turkey might attack Russian planes? Did we give Erdogan a green light to shoot them down?

These are not insignificant questions.

For Turkey is a NATO ally. And if Russia strikes back, there is a possibility Ankara will invoke Article V of NATO and demand that we come in on their side in any fight with Russia.

And Putin was not at all cowed. Twenty-four hours after that plane went down, his planes, ships and artillery were firing on those same Turkmen rebels and their jihadist allies.

Politically, the Turkish attack on the Sukhoi Su-24 has probably aborted plans to have Russia join France and the U.S. in targeting ISIS, a diplomatic reversal of the first order.

Indeed, it now seems clear that in Syria’s civil war, Turkey is on the rebel-jihadist side, with Russia, Iran, and Hezbollah on the side of the Syrian regime.

But whose side are we on ?

As for what strategy and solution President Obama offers, and how exactly he plans to achieve it, it remains an enigma.

Nor is this the end of the alarming news.

According to The Times of Israel, Damascus reports that, on Monday, Israel launched four strikes, killing five Syrian soldiers and eight Hezbollah fighters, and wounding others.

Should Assad or Hezbollah retaliate, this could bring Israel more openly into the Syrian civil war. And if Israel is attacked, the pressure on Washington to join her in attacking the Syrian regime and Hezbollah would become intense.

Yet, should we accede to that pressure, it could bring us into direct conflict with Russia, which is now the fighting ally of the Assad regime. Something U.S. presidents conscientiously avoided through 45 years of Cold War — a military clash with Moscow — could become a real possibility. Does the White House see what is unfolding here?

Elsewhere, yet another Russia-NATO clash may be brewing.

In southern Ukraine, pylons supporting the power lines that deliver electricity to Crimea have been sabotaged, blown up, reportedly by nationalists, shutting off much of the electric power to the peninsula.

Repair crews have been prevented from fixing the pylons by Crimean Tatars, angry at the treatment of their kinfolk in Crimea. In solidarity with the Tatars, Kiev has declared that trucks carrying goods to Crimea will not be allowed to cross the border. A state of emergency has been declared in Crimea.

Russia is retaliating, saying it will not buy produce from Ukraine, and may start cutting off gas and coal as winter begins to set in.

Ukraine is as dependent upon Russia for fossil fuels as Crimea is upon Ukraine for electricity. Crimea receives 85 percent of its water and 80 percent of its electricity from Ukraine.

Moreover, Moscow’s hopes for a lifting of U.S. and EU sanctions, imposed after the annexation of Crimea, appear to be fading.

Are these events coordinated? Has the U.S. government given a go-ahead to Erdogan to shoot down Russian planes? Has Obama authorized a Ukrainian economic quarantine of Crimea?

For Vladimir Putin is not without options. The Russian Army and pro-Russian rebels in southeast Ukraine could occupy Mariupol on the Black Sea and establish a land bridge to Crimea in two weeks. In Syria, the Russians, with 4,000 troops, could escalate far more rapidly than either us or our French allies.

As of today, Putin supports U.S.-French attacks on ISIS. But if we follow the Turks and begin aiding the rebels who are attacking the Syrian army, we could find ourselves eyeball to eyeball in a confrontation with Russia, where our NATO allies will be nowhere to be found.

Has anyone thought this through?

Obviously not

Zbigniew Brzezinski sayin, U.S. and Russian interests are in fact aligned in many ways.

Yes, Doc, Monster, Mr. Perfect, which side are on ? ? with terrorists or with those bombing the terrorists


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[Mr. Perfect]

I'm with Trump. Go Putin go.

[noddy]

i just consult the handy chart.

[Heracleum Persicum]

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Putin 'Only Real Statesman Left in Anti-ISIL War
Rest are Chamberlains'

"Today," the essayist notes, in the global war against jihadist terrorism, "we face the same situation. All the world's politicians, apart from one, are Chamberlains" of the modern age. "The only true statesman left in the world," Sanchez Drago argues, "is Vladimir Putin."

.. true


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[Doc]

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Putin 'Only Real Statesman Left in Anti-ISIL War
Rest are Chamberlains'

"Today," the essayist notes, in the global war against jihadist terrorism, "we face the same situation. All the world's politicians, apart from one, are Chamberlains" of the modern age. "The only true statesman left in the world," Sanchez Drago argues, "is Vladimir Putin."

.. true
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[Heracleum Persicum]

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Putin has ‘proof’ ISIS oil routed through Turkey
Erdogan says he’ll resign if it’s true

Russia has received additional intelligence confirming that oil from deposits controlled by Islamic State is moved through Turkey on an industrial scale, said Vladimir Putin. President Recep Erdogan said he will resign if this is confirmed.

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“At the moment we have received additional information confirming that that oil from the deposits controlled by Islamic State militants enters Turkish territory on industrial scale,” he said.

“We have every reason to believe that the decision to down our plane was guided by a desire to ensure security of this oil’s delivery routes to ports where they are shipped in tankers,” Putin said.

Speaking in Paris on Monday, President Recep Erdogan said that he will leave office if there is proof of Turkey’s cooperation with IS.

“We are not that dishonest as to buy oil from terrorists. If it is proven that we have, in fact, done so, I will leave office. If there is any evidence, let them present it, we’ll consider [it],” he said, as quoted by TASS.

..

Putin said he has heard Ankara’s claims that it was not Erdogan who made the decision to down the Russian jet. However, he stressed that for Russia “it doesn’t really matter” which official made the decision.

“As a result of this criminal campaign our two soldiers died – a crew commander and a marine, who was part of the rescue team of the [Su-24] crew,” he said, adding that Turkey’s actions had been “a huge mistake.”

Interesting

If Putin has water tight hard evidence Stollen Syrian and Iraqi Oil goes to Turkey (with Turkish knowledge), now the time to put it on the table.

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[Mr. Perfect]

Putin 'Only Real Statesman Left in Anti-ISIL War
Rest are Chamberlains'

"Today," the essayist notes, in the global war against jihadist terrorism, "we face the same situation. All the world's politicians, apart from one, are Chamberlains" of the modern age. "The only true statesman left in the world," Sanchez Drago argues, "is Vladimir Putin."

.. true

We told you, obama huge mistake. Libya (obama/Clinton) now ISIS stronghold, this morning paper.

Trump Putin axis emerging.

[Heracleum Persicum]

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planes are equipped with the missiles “for defensive purposes."

Klimov also noted that the air-to-air missiles are capable of hitting targets at a distance of up to 60 kilometers (37 miles).

dd0YCn7oRIc


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[Mr. Perfect]

I been telling Milo, Franz Ferdinand. His head in the sand.

[Heracleum Persicum]

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Trump Putin axis emerging.

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[Doc]

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government ... mic-state/

Benghazi Commission: Obama Admin Gun-Running Scheme Armed Islamic State

Flickr/Amir Farshad Ebraham

by Edwin Mora30 Nov 2015Washington, D.C. 3,260
The Obama administration pursued a policy in Libya back in 2011 that ultimately allowed guns to walk into the hands of jihadists linked to the Islamic State (ISIS/ISIL) and al-Qaeda (AQ) in Syria, according to a former CIA officer who co-authored a report on behalf of the Citizen’s Commission on Benghazi (CCB), detailing the gun running scheme.

In Congress, the then-bipartisan group known as the “Gang of Eight,” at a minimum, knew of the operation to aid and abet America’s jihadist enemies by providing them with material support. So says Clare Lopez, a former CIA officer and the primary author of CCB’s interim report, titled How America Switched Sides in the War on Terror, speaking with Breitbart News.

The ripple effects of the illegal policy to arm America’s enemies continue to be felt as the U.S. military is currently leading a war against ISIS and AQ terrorists in Iraq and Syria, according to Lopez.

In late October, Defense Secretary Ash Carter said that the U.S. would begin “direct action on the ground” against ISIS terrorists in Iraq and Syria who may have reaped the benefits from the gun-running scheme that started in Libya.

“The Obama administration effectively switched sides in what used to be called the Global War on Terror [GWOT] when it decided to overthrow the sovereign government of our Libyan ally, Muammar Qaddafi, who’d been helping in the fight against al-Qaeda, by actually teaming up with and facilitating gun-running to Libyan al-Qaeda and Muslim Brotherhood [MB] elements there in 2011,” explained Lopez. “This U.S. gun-running policy in 2011 during the Libyan revolution was directed by [then] Secretary of State Hillary Clinton and [the late Libya Ambassador] Christopher Stevens, who was her official envoy to the Libyan AQ rebels.”

To avoid having the funds tracked back to the Obama administration, the arms flow to Libya was financed thru the United Arab Emirates, while Qatar served as the logistical and shipping hub, she noted.

“In 2012, the gun-running into Libya turned around and began to flow outward, from Benghazi to the AQ-and-MB-dominated rebels in Syria,” Lopez added. “This time, it was the CIA Base of Operations that was in charge of collecting up and shipping out [surface-to-air missiles] SAMs from Libya on Libyan ships to Turkey for overland delivery to a variety of jihadist militias, some of whose members later coalesced into groups like Jabhat al-Nusra and ISIS [also known as IS].”

Jabhat al-Nusra is al-Qaeda’s Syrian affiliate.

“The downstream consequences of Obama White House decisions in the Syrian conflict are still playing out, but certainly the U.S. – and particularly CIA – support of identifiable jihadist groups associated with the Muslim Brotherhood, Jabhat al-Nusra, Ahrar al-Sham, the Islamic State and other [jihadists] has only exacerbated what was already a devastating situation,” declared Lopez.

Some of the other weapons that eventually ended up in Syria included thousands of MAN-Portable-Air-Defense-System (MANPADS) missile units, such as shoulder-launched SAMs, from late dictator Muammar Qaddafi’s extensive arms stockpiles that pose a threat to low-flying aircraft, especially helicopters.

“It’s been reported that President Obama signed an Executive Order on Syria in early 2012 [just as he had done for Libya in early 2011], that legally covered the CIA and other U.S. agencies that otherwise would have been in violation of aiding and abetting the enemy in time of war and providing material support to terrorism,” notes Lopez. “Still, such blatant disregard for U.S. national security can only be described as deeply corrosive of core American principles.”

Libya Amb. Stevens was killed by jihadists in Benghazi on September 11, 2012, along with three other Americans.

Echoing a Benghazi resident who provided a first-hand account of the incident, retired U.S. Air Force Lt. Col. Dennis Haney, a CCB member, suggested to Breitbart News that Hillary Clinton’s State Department armed some of the al-Qaeda linked jihadists who may have killed the four Americans in Benghazi.

“The reason the U.S. government was operating in Libya is absolutely critical to this debacle because it reflects where America went off the tracks and literally switched sides in the GWOT,” points out Lopez. “This is about who we are as a country, as a people — where we are going with this Republic of ours.”

“There can be no greater treason than aiding and abetting the jihadist enemy in time of war – or providing material – weapons, funding, intel, NATO bombing – support to terrorism,” she continued. “The reason Benghazi is not the burning issue it ought to be is because so many at top levels of U.S. government were implicated in wrong-doing: White House, Pentagon, Intel Community-CIA, Gang of Eight, at a minimum, in Congress, the Department of State, etc.”

The State Department and the CIA did not respond to Breitbart News’ requests for comment.

Clinton was asked about the gun running operation when testifying before the House Select Committee on Benghazi in October.

The Democratic presidential frontrunner claimed she was not aware of any U.S. government efforts to arm jihadists in Libya and Syria.

Clinton did admit to being open to the idea of using private security experts to arm the Qaddafi opposition, which included al-Qaeda elements, but added that it was “not considered seriously.”

[Heracleum Persicum]

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government ... mic-state/

Benghazi Commission: Obama Admin Gun-Running Scheme Armed Islamic State

Flickr/Amir Farshad Ebraham

by Edwin Mora30 Nov 2015Washington, D.C. 3,260
The Obama administration pursued a policy in Libya back in 2011 that ultimately allowed guns to walk into the hands of jihadists linked to the Islamic State (ISIS/ISIL) and al-Qaeda (AQ) in Syria, according to a former CIA officer who co-authored a report on behalf of the Citizen’s Commission on Benghazi (CCB), detailing the gun running scheme.

In Congress, the then-bipartisan group known as the “Gang of Eight,” at a minimum, knew of the operation to aid and abet America’s jihadist enemies by providing them with material support. So says Clare Lopez, a former CIA officer and the primary author of CCB’s interim report, titled How America Switched Sides in the War on Terror, speaking with Breitbart News.

The ripple effects of the illegal policy to arm America’s enemies continue to be felt as the U.S. military is currently leading a war against ISIS and AQ terrorists in Iraq and Syria, according to Lopez.

In late October, Defense Secretary Ash Carter said that the U.S. would begin “direct action on the ground” against ISIS terrorists in Iraq and Syria who may have reaped the benefits from the gun-running scheme that started in Libya.

“The Obama administration effectively switched sides in what used to be called the Global War on Terror [GWOT] when it decided to overthrow the sovereign government of our Libyan ally, Muammar Qaddafi, who’d been helping in the fight against al-Qaeda, by actually teaming up with and facilitating gun-running to Libyan al-Qaeda and Muslim Brotherhood [MB] elements there in 2011,” explained Lopez. “This U.S. gun-running policy in 2011 during the Libyan revolution was directed by [then] Secretary of State Hillary Clinton and [the late Libya Ambassador] Christopher Stevens, who was her official envoy to the Libyan AQ rebels.”

To avoid having the funds tracked back to the Obama administration, the arms flow to Libya was financed thru the United Arab Emirates, while Qatar served as the logistical and shipping hub, she noted.

“In 2012, the gun-running into Libya turned around and began to flow outward, from Benghazi to the AQ-and-MB-dominated rebels in Syria,” Lopez added. “This time, it was the CIA Base of Operations that was in charge of collecting up and shipping out [surface-to-air missiles] SAMs from Libya on Libyan ships to Turkey for overland delivery to a variety of jihadist militias, some of whose members later coalesced into groups like Jabhat al-Nusra and ISIS [also known as IS].”

Jabhat al-Nusra is al-Qaeda’s Syrian affiliate.

“The downstream consequences of Obama White House decisions in the Syrian conflict are still playing out, but certainly the U.S. – and particularly CIA – support of identifiable jihadist groups associated with the Muslim Brotherhood, Jabhat al-Nusra, Ahrar al-Sham, the Islamic State and other [jihadists] has only exacerbated what was already a devastating situation,” declared Lopez.

Some of the other weapons that eventually ended up in Syria included thousands of MAN-Portable-Air-Defense-System (MANPADS) missile units, such as shoulder-launched SAMs, from late dictator Muammar Qaddafi’s extensive arms stockpiles that pose a threat to low-flying aircraft, especially helicopters.

“It’s been reported that President Obama signed an Executive Order on Syria in early 2012 [just as he had done for Libya in early 2011], that legally covered the CIA and other U.S. agencies that otherwise would have been in violation of aiding and abetting the enemy in time of war and providing material support to terrorism,” notes Lopez. “Still, such blatant disregard for U.S. national security can only be described as deeply corrosive of core American principles.”

Libya Amb. Stevens was killed by jihadists in Benghazi on September 11, 2012, along with three other Americans.

Echoing a Benghazi resident who provided a first-hand account of the incident, retired U.S. Air Force Lt. Col. Dennis Haney, a CCB member, suggested to Breitbart News that Hillary Clinton’s State Department armed some of the al-Qaeda linked jihadists who may have killed the four Americans in Benghazi.

“The reason the U.S. government was operating in Libya is absolutely critical to this debacle because it reflects where America went off the tracks and literally switched sides in the GWOT,” points out Lopez. “This is about who we are as a country, as a people — where we are going with this Republic of ours.”

“There can be no greater treason than aiding and abetting the jihadist enemy in time of war – or providing material – weapons, funding, intel, NATO bombing – support to terrorism,” she continued. “The reason Benghazi is not the burning issue it ought to be is because so many at top levels of U.S. government were implicated in wrong-doing: White House, Pentagon, Intel Community-CIA, Gang of Eight, at a minimum, in Congress, the Department of State, etc.”

The State Department and the CIA did not respond to Breitbart News’ requests for comment.

Clinton was asked about the gun running operation when testifying before the House Select Committee on Benghazi in October.

The Democratic presidential frontrunner claimed she was not aware of any U.S. government efforts to arm jihadists in Libya and Syria.

Clinton did admit to being open to the idea of using private security experts to arm the Qaddafi opposition, which included al-Qaeda elements, but added that it was “not considered seriously.”

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“ Each War Is Preceded By A Big Media Lie ”

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“I think it would be prudent to remember that each war is preceded with a big media lie. When the USA attacked Vietnam they said it was because two Vietnamese warships attacked their fleet; this was false. When we attacked Iraq, it was because they had weapons of mass destruction, that they were accomplices of Al Qaeda. This was false. When we attacked Afghanistan, it was because they were responsible for 9/11. This was false.There is a media lie for each war. After, we know it’s false, but the damage is already done.”

..

He continues: “We’re told that Gaddafi is shooting at civilians; we’ve yet to see evidence”(watching the video with hindsight reminds us that we never did). He points out Gaddafi offended Israel and the West by supporting Palestine, and by nationalizing Libya’s oil, which made him an enemy of EXXON, Total and BP. Collon also correctly states that Egypt and Tunisia’s governments were once supported by the USA. But the White House feared that if the two countries kept growing, along with Libya they would cause a geopolitical nightmare for Israel…so both leaders (Ben Ali and Mubarak) were ousted during the Arab Spring.

“What is the criteria, according to Europe and the USA, to distinguish the good Arab {countries] from the bad?” Collon asks, attacking the fickleness and double standards of the West. He goes on to suggests a few. Are the ‘good’ Arab countries those which hold democratic elections? Palestine just did that, Collon points out, yet the voter’s choice (Hamas won 56%) was disregarded. The Palestinian President won just 2%, but he was supported by the West. Is he a good Arab or a bad Arab, Collon asks?

“Well, surely he’s bad for not recognizing democracy. But no, according to the West he’s good. And those we bombed were the Palestinians because they didn’t vote well.” He goes on to list Saudia Arabian crimes, largely ignored by the West because the country does as it is told. “The good Arab, in the end, is the Arab who kneels, gives his oil to the USA, and this same guy will be able to treat women as slaves, commit torture and terrorism, and he will never be punished by Sarkozy (former President of France] and Obama,” Collon tells the panel.

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Said B4, ELITE runs things, Joe just fooled .. Media a tool of ELITE (to fool Joe)

Different cultures, civilizations, each have their OWN kind of "social contract" with their own Joe.


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[noddy]

joe is not fooled, only university kids with a head full of kool aid think democracy means people power, the rest of us just laugh and go back to work.

i was taught democracy should let me throw out dangeoursly rubbish government without a bloody revolution, no more, no less, its not a plebacite, we dont get to set the agenda, all we get to do is remove one durian and the let the other durian have a go.

i cant even afford to spend years fighting the local council to build the house i want, bugger foreign policy.

[Typhoon]

joe is not fooled, only university kids with a head full of kool aid think democracy means people power, the rest of us just laugh and go back to work.

i was taught democracy should let me throw out dangeoursly rubbish government without a bloody revolution, no more, no less, its not a plebacite, we dont get to set the agenda, all we get to do is remove one durian and the let the other durian have a go.

i cant even afford to spend years fighting the local council to build the house i want, bugger foreign policy.

There are only two problems with representative democracy:

1/ It is not representative; and

2/ It is not democratic

Otherwise, it is a perfect system.

[Heracleum Persicum]

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Meet The Man Who Funds ISIS
Bilal Erdogan
The Son Of Turkey's President

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Information ClearingHouse

Meet The Man Who Funds ISIS: Bilal Erdogan, The Son Of Turkey's President

By Tyler Durden

November 26, 2015 "Information Clearing House" - "Zero Hedge" - Russia's Sergey Lavrov is not one foreign minister known to mince his words. Just earlier today, 24 hours after a Russian plane was brought down by the country whose president three years ago said "a short-term border violation can never be a pretext for an attack", had this to say: "We have serious doubts this was an unintended incident and believe this is a planned provocation" by Turkey.

But even that was tame compared to what Lavrov said to his Turkish counterparty Mevlut Cavusoglu earlier today during a phone call between the two (Lavrov who was supposed to travel to Turkey has since canceled such plans).

As Sputnik transcribes, according to a press release from Russia’s Ministry of Foreign Affairs, Lavrov pointed out that, "by shooting down a Russian plane on a counter-terrorist mission of the Russian Aerospace Force in Syria, and one that did not violate Turkey’s airspace, the Turkish government has in effect sided with ISIS."

It was in this context when Lavrov added that "Turkey’s actions appear premeditated, planned, and undertaken with a specific objective."

More importantly, Lavrov pointed to Turkey’s role in the propping up the terror network through the oil trade. Per the Russian statement:

"The Russian Minister reminded his counterpart about Turkey’s involvement in the ISIS’ illegal trade in oil, which is transported via the area where the Russian plane was shot down, and about the terrorist infrastructure, arms and munitions depots and control centers that are also located there."

Others reaffirmed Lavrov's stance, such as retired French General Dominique Trinquand, who said that "Turkey is either not fighting ISIL at all or very little, and does not interfere with different types of smuggling that takes place on its border, be it oil, phosphate, cotton or people," he said.

The reason we find this line of questioning fascinating is that just last week in the aftermath of the French terror attack but long before the Turkish downing of the Russian jet, we wrote about "The Most Important Question About ISIS That Nobody Is Asking" in which we asked who is the one "breaching every known law of funding terrorism when buying ISIS crude, almost certainly with the tacit approval by various "western alliance" governments, and why is it that these governments have allowed said middleman to continue funding ISIS for as long as it has?"

Precisely one week later, in even more tragic circumstances, suddenly everyone is asking this question.

And while we patiently dig to find who the on and offshore "commodity trading" middleman are, who cart away ISIS oil to European and other international markets in exchange for hundreds of millions of dollars, one name keeps popping up as the primary culprit of regional demand for the Islamic State's "terrorist oil" - that of Turkish president Recep Erdogan's son: Bilal Erdogan.

His very brief bio:

Necmettin Bilal Erdogan, commonly known as Bilal Erdogan (born 23 April 1980) is the third child of Recep Tayyip Erdo?an, the current President of Turkey.

After graduating from Kartal Imam Hatip High School in 1999, Bilal Erdogan moved to the US for undergraduate education. He also earned a Masters Degree in John F. Kennedy School of Government at Harvard University in 2004. After graduation, he served in the World Bank as intern for a while. He returned Turkey in 2006 and started to his business life. Bilal Erdogan is one of the three equal shareholders of "BMZ Group Denizcilik ", a marine transportation corporation.

Here is a recent picture of Bilal, shown in a photo from a Turkish 2014 article, which "asked why his ships are now in Syria":

bilal erdogan.jpg (27.22 KiB) Viewed 1900 times

In the next few days, we will present a full breakdown of Bilal's various business ventures, starting with his BMZ Group which is the name implicated most often in the smuggling of illegal Iraqi and Islamic State through to the western supply chain, but for now here is a brief, if very disturbing snapshot, of both father and son Erdogan by F. William Engdahl, one which should make everyone ask whether the son of Turkey's president (and thus, the father) is the silent mastermind who has been responsible for converting millions of barrels of Syrian Oil into hundreds of millions of dollars of Islamic State revenue.

By F. William Engdahl, posted originally in New Eastern Outlook:

Erdogan's Dirth Dangerous ISIS Games

More and more details are coming to light revealing that the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria, variously known as ISIS, IS or Daesh, is being fed and kept alive by Recep Tayyip Erdogan, the Turkish President and by his Turkish intelligence service, including MIT, the Turkish CIA. Turkey, as a result of Erdogan’s pursuit of what some call a Neo-Ottoman Empire fantasies that stretch all the way to China, Syria and Iraq, threatens not only to destroy Turkey but much of the Middle East if he continues on his present path.

In October 2014 US Vice President Joe Biden told a Harvard gathering that Erdogan’s regime was backing ISIS with “hundreds of millions of dollars and thousands of tons of weapons…” Biden later apologized clearly for tactical reasons to get Erdo?an’s permission to use Turkey’s Incirlik Air Base for airstrikes against ISIS in Syria, but the dimensions of Erdogan’s backing for ISIS since revealed is far, far more than Biden hinted.

ISIS militants were trained by US, Israeli and now it emerges, by Turkish special forces at secret bases in Konya Province inside the Turkish border to Syria, over the past three years. Erdo?an’s involvement in ISIS goes much deeper. At a time when Washington, Saudi Arabia and even Qatar appear to have cut off their support for ISIS, they remaining amazingly durable. The reason appears to be the scale of the backing from Erdo?an and his fellow neo-Ottoman Sunni Islam Prime Minister, Ahmet Davuto?lu.

Nice Family Business

The prime source of money feeding ISIS these days is sale of Iraqi oil from the Mosul region oilfields where they maintain a stronghold. The son of Erdogan it seems is the man who makes the export sales of ISIS-controlled oil possible.

Bilal Erdo?an owns several maritime companies. He has allegedly signed contracts with European operating companies to carry Iraqi stolen oil to different Asian countries. The Turkish government buys Iraqi plundered oil which is being produced from the Iraqi seized oil wells. Bilal Erdogan’s maritime companies own special wharfs in Beirut and Ceyhan ports that are transporting ISIS’ smuggled crude oil in Japan-bound oil tankers.

Gürsel Tekin vice-president of the Turkish Republican Peoples’ Party, CHP, declared in a recent Turkish media interview, “President Erdogan claims that according to international transportation conventions there is no legal infraction concerning Bilal’s illicit activities and his son is doing an ordinary business with the registered Japanese companies, but in fact Bilal Erdo?an is up to his neck in complicity with terrorism, but as long as his father holds office he will be immune from any judicial prosecution.” Tekin adds that Bilal’s maritime company doing the oil trades for ISIS, BMZ Ltd, is “a family business and president Erdogan’s close relatives hold shares in BMZ and they misused public funds and took illicit loans from Turkish banks.”

In addition to son Bilal’s illegal and lucrative oil trading for ISIS, Sümeyye Erdogan, the daughter of the Turkish President apparently runs a secret hospital camp inside Turkey just over the Syrian border where Turkish army trucks daily being in scores of wounded ISIS Jihadists to be patched up and sent back to wage the bloody Jihad in Syria, according to the testimony of a nurse who was recruited to work there until it was discovered she was a member of the Alawite branch of Islam, the same as Syrian President Bashar al-Assad who Erdogan seems hell-bent on toppling.

Turkish citizen Ramazan Bagol, captured this month by Kurdish People’s Defence Units,YPG, as he attempted to join ISIS from Konya province, told his captors that said he was sent to ISIS by the ‘Ismailia Sect,’ a strict Turkish Islam sect reported to be tied to Recep Erdogan. Baol said the sect recruits members and provides logistic support to the radical Islamist organization. He added that the Sect gives jihad training in neighborhoods of Konya and sends those trained here to join ISIS gangs in Syria.

According to French geopolitical analyst, Thierry Meyssan, Recep Erdogan “organised the pillage of Syria, dismantled all the factories in Aleppo, the economic capital, and stole the machine-tools. Similarly, he organised the theft of archeological treasures and set up an international market in Antioch…with the help of General Benoît Puga, Chief of Staff for the Elysée, he organised a false-flag operation intended to provoke the launching of a war by the Atlantic Alliance – the chemical bombing of la Ghoutta in Damascus, in August 2013. “

Meyssan claims that the Syria strategy of Erdogan was initially secretly developed in coordination with former French Foreign Minister Alain Juppé and Erdogan’s then Foreign Minister Ahmet Davuto?lu, in 2011, after Juppe won a hesitant Erdogan to the idea of supporting the attack on traditional Turkish ally Syria in return for a promise of French support for Turkish membership in the EU. France later backed out, leaving Erdogan to continue the Syrian bloodbath largely on his own using ISIS.

Gen. John R. Allen, an opponent of Obama’s Iran peace strategy, now US diplomatic envoy coordinating the coalition against the Islamic State, exceeded his authorized role after meeting with Erdogan and “promised to create a "no-fly zone" ninety miles wide, over Syrian territory, along the whole border with Turkey, supposedly intended to help Syrian refugees fleeing from their government, but in reality to apply the "Juppé-Wright plan". The Turkish Prime Minister, Ahmet Davutoglu, revealed US support for the project on the TV channel A Haber by launching a bombing raid against the PKK.” Meyssan adds.

There are never winners in war and Erdogan’s war against Syria’s Assad demonstrates that in bold. Turkey and the world deserve better. Ahmet Davutoglu’s famous “Zero Problems With Neighbors” foreign policy has been turned into massive problems with all neighbors due to the foolish ambitions of Erdogan and his gang.

Bilal Erdogan can not do all this without American, European agreement .. probably he just front for CIA

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[Mr. Perfect]

All goes back to obama. Been telling you az.

[Typhoon]

Please only post link to article and one paragraph:

1/ Posting most or all of an article takes up too much thread page space

2/ No one here wants to deal with copyright issues.

[Heracleum Persicum]

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Washington Post
Many Iraqis believe the U.S. is helping the Islamic State

Iraqi fighters say they have all seen the videos purportedly showing U.S. helicopters airdropping weapons to the militants, and many claim they have friends and relatives who have witnessed similar instances of collusion.

Ordinary people also have seen the videos, heard the stories and reached the same conclusion — one that might seem absurd to Americans but is widely believed among Iraqis — that the United States is supporting the Islamic State for a variety of pernicious reasons that have to do with asserting U.S. control over Iraq, the wider Middle East and, perhaps, its oil.

“It is not in doubt,” said Mustafa Saadi, who says his friend saw U.S. helicopters delivering bottled water to Islamic State positions. He is a commander in one of the Shiite militias that last month helped push the militants out of the oil refinery near Baiji in northern Iraq alongside the Iraqi army.

The Islamic State is “almost finished,” he said. “They are weak. If only America would stop supporting them, we could defeat them in days.”

..

In one typical recent video that appeared on the Facebook page of a Shiite militia, a lawmaker with the country’s biggest militia group, the Badr Organization, waves apparently new U.S military MREs (meals ready to eat) — one of them chicken and dumplings — allegedly found at a recently captured Islamic State base in Baiji, offering proof, he said, of U.S. support.

“The Iranians and the Iranian-backed Shiite militias are really pushing this line of propaganda, that the United States is supporting ISIL,” Warren said. “It’s part of the Iranian propaganda machine.”

..

“The image of the U.S. was damaged in the region, so they created Daesh in order to fight them and restore their image,” said Mohammed Abdul Khaleq, a journalist for a local TV station who was drinking coffee in a cafe favored by writers, most of whom said they agreed.

A rare dissenting voice was offered by Hassan Abdul-Wahab, 23, selling luggage in a nearby shop. “It is true that most people believe that,” he said. “But it’s not based on reason. It’s based on racism — because Iraqis don’t like Americans in the first place.”

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