Evolution

[Mr. Perfect]

might have

Lol you do this in almost every other post.

Popular speculations about how life evolved out of a soup of chemicals on the early Earth often focus on the origins of DNA and RNA, the molecules of genetic information. But the genesis of genes is only one of the mysteries that origin-of-life theories must reckon with. Another is the rise of metabolism — the biochemical processes inside cells that make life possible by continuously drawing energy from the environment and directing it into the assembly of vital molecules. It’s a complex problem on which there has been little headway.

You could say no headway.

Here is why.

1:23:48 it's not possible

ADiql3FG5is

[Typhoon]

"Because quantum" asserts no such thing.

The bit in between your initial and concluding assertions needs work

underpants-gnomes.png (76.42 KiB) Viewed 637664 times

[Simple Minded]

If anyone needs a datapoint, it's been 7 years and this thread hasn't evolved not one tiny little bit......

or would that be considered an analogy?

[Mr. Perfect]

"Because quantum" asserts no such thing.

The bit in between your initial and concluding assertions needs work


underpants-gnomes.png

You didn't watch the clip I timestamped, so your argument is again a strawman. It's only a few minutes, and someone from your side is saying it maybe in language you would understand.

[Mr. Perfect]

If anyone needs a datapoint, it's been 7 years and this thread hasn't evolved not one tiny little bit......

or would that be considered an analogy?

Good point. After 7 years no science has emerged to support evolution.

[Mr. Perfect]

Another way of looking at it is Evolution was announced by Darwin in 1858, so it is a hypothesis that is 162 years old. The 7 year period referenced by SM makes up 4.32 percent of the history or the hypothesis. In almost 5% of the history of the hypothesis that we lived through together no science has been found to support the hypothesis. 162 years, no scientific support. It's almost like people are clinging in bitterness.

[Miss_Faucie_Fishtits]

I think it can't be said enough that the dogma of the day was Turgot's Progress- as taught by Condorcet, by Lessig and Hegel, by Spencer....and the dominant religion of the upper classes and intellectual circles was pantheism.

mMgdDPaoJbE

[NapLajoieonSteroids]

wvfR3XLXPvw

[Mr. Perfect]

Nothing evolved into a crab

[Mr. Perfect]

I think it can't be said enough that the dogma of the day was Turgot's Progress- as taught by Condorcet, by Lessig and Hegel, by Spencer....and the dominant religion of the upper classes and intellectual circles was pantheism.

Great video btw
mMgdDPaoJbE

[NapLajoieonSteroids]

Nothing evolved into a crab

They can't even tell you what a crab is.

[noddy]

the debate has neither expanded, nor evolved nor shown any signs of intelligent design.

im not saying it was aliens, but it must be aliens.

2 years ago

If anyone needs a datapoint, it's been 7 years and this thread hasn't evolved not one tiny little bit......

or would that be considered an analogy?

[NapLajoieonSteroids]

An evolution argument thread is the greatest hit of the internet; it's a timeless classic of message boards.

Scott Alexander of Star Slate Codex pointed out some time ago that in the early 2000s you couldn't go anywhere on the internet without running into a long running evolution v creation debate thread. Then suddenly, almost overnight, it completely vanished.

He then goes through the 'whys': maybe having something to do with the rise of social media; the decline of blogs & message boards-- both leading to a decline in quality of communication; maybe it being played out [though he points out that the topic was already pretty old&boring with two group talking over each other when it exploded everywhere.]

[noddy]

low stakes banter.

noo atheists are probably a bit too righteous to enjoy them.

[NapLajoieonSteroids]

Well, he points out how many of the community wholesale moved on to social justice. He thinks [as I recall] it awfully strange how suddenly all these groups were super into social justice and 57 flavors of gender and the whole bag of goodies...with a few unreconstructed reprobates who jumped into 24/7 opposition attached. His analogy was something along the lines of: imagine if major feminist groups just one day decided that their most pressing concern was climate change and just dropped abortion wholesale from the agenda. It would be super weird.

[noddy]

Well, he points out how many of the community wholesale moved on to social justice. He thinks [as I recall] it awfully strange how suddenly all these groups were super into social justice and 57 flavors of gender and the whole bag of goodies...with a few unreconstructed reprobates who jumped into 24/7 opposition attached. His analogy was something along the lines of: imagine if major feminist groups just one day decided that their most pressing concern was climate change and just dropped abortion wholesale from the agenda. It would be super weird.

yeh, the rise of the gender obsessed ones is an interesting thing.

in the grand scheme of things they are massively over represented on the social media, far less apparent in the actual flesher world - barring certain parts of certain cities which are their natural habitats.

[NapLajoieonSteroids]

Here is the blog post which came to mind:

Slate Star Codex: New Atheism, the Godlessness that Failed

[Simple Minded]

the debate has neither expanded, nor evolved nor shown any signs of intelligent design.

im not saying it was aliens, but it must be aliens.

2 years ago

If anyone needs a datapoint, it's been 7 years and this thread hasn't evolved not one tiny little bit......

or would that be considered an analogy?

Once we get everyone to agree it's either God or Aliens, then we can split up into factions and start arguing about which God or which Aliens!!!

I'd rather get probed by a blonde female Nordic than a cybernetic grey or a reptilian.....

[Simple Minded]

yeh, the rise of the gender obsessed ones is an interesting thing.

in the grand scheme of things they are massively over represented on the social media, far less apparent in the actual flesher world - barring certain parts of certain cities which are their natural habitats.

Small subsets of populations need to herd together in order for enough genetic variation to be available to ensure a viable breeding population.

Otherwise they won't evolve and they will go extinct.

[noddy]

yeh, the rise of the gender obsessed ones is an interesting thing.

in the grand scheme of things they are massively over represented on the social media, far less apparent in the actual flesher world - barring certain parts of certain cities which are their natural habitats.

Small subsets of populations need to herd together in order for enough genetic variation to be available to ensure a viable breeding population.

Otherwise they won't evolve and they will go extinct.

meet_the_parents_2.gif (918.47 KiB) Viewed 637565 times

[noddy]

Here is the blog post which came to mind:

Slate Star Codex: New Atheism, the Godlessness that Failed

of that I suspect the biggest factor is the lack of much effort fort creationism outside certain parts of America and apparently Turkey.

Ive never met a creationist Christian in my country - Im sure their are some to be found in the rural areas but they wouldnt be on the internet and it would be low on the list of things they believe which dont correlate to modern city culture.

evolution as the mechanism by which god plays with life seems to be the more common interpretation of it all.

[NapLajoieonSteroids]

Here is the blog post which came to mind:

Slate Star Codex: New Atheism, the Godlessness that Failed

of that I suspect the biggest factor is the lack of much effort fort creationism outside certain parts of America and apparently Turkey.

Ive never met a creationist Christian in my country - Im sure their are some to be found in the rural areas but they wouldnt be on the internet and it would be low on the list of things they believe which dont correlate to modern city culture.

evolution as the mechanism by which god plays with life seems to be the more common interpretation of it all.

Yes, I can see that.

I haven't met a christian creationist either (in this more specific sense). I also asked the missus if she has actually come across it in the wild, and she's a negative on it too.

At the same time (and in another Alexander blog post) 40+% of the Americans still tell pollsters they are creationists-- which suggests that the wrongs things are being looked at/the wrong questions asked.

I do think this creationist label as a pejorative doesn't help. For all intents and purposes I am a creationist too-- I believe in our God is a creator we exist as we are His creation. Not that it is either here nor there, but I and assume many others would be poorly captured in how popular or articulated these things actually are.

[noddy]

Here is the blog post which came to mind:

Slate Star Codex: New Atheism, the Godlessness that Failed

of that I suspect the biggest factor is the lack of much effort fort creationism outside certain parts of America and apparently Turkey.

Ive never met a creationist Christian in my country - Im sure their are some to be found in the rural areas but they wouldnt be on the internet and it would be low on the list of things they believe which dont correlate to modern city culture.

evolution as the mechanism by which god plays with life seems to be the more common interpretation of it all.

Yes, I can see that.

I haven't met a christian creationist either (in this more specific sense). I also asked the missus if she has actually come across it in the wild, and she's a negative on it too.

At the same time (and in another Alexander blog post) 40+% of the Americans still tell pollsters they are creationists-- which suggests that the wrongs things are being looked at/the wrong questions asked.

I do think this creationist label as a pejorative doesn't help. For all intents and purposes I am a creationist too-- I believe in our God is a creator we exist as we are His creation. Not that it is either here nor there, but I and assume many others would be poorly captured in how popular or articulated these things actually are.

yeh - this is an American phenomena that various christians have different points at which they tap out of the discussion

1) evolution changing species colours and shapes and behaviours (wolves to dogs, goats to sheep)
2) evolution changing a species so much its a new species (bears and wolves having a common ancestor, chickens being dinosaurs)
3) evolution as the start of life, from organic chemistry

at each of these points it can just be a mechanism by which god acts in the physical world - even the start of life "made from mud" part.

so the phrasing of the question is important , no doubt.

god created everything via a lightning strike into a puddle of organic goo being the murky part of the discussion... or did god create the puddle of goo and the lightning.. or ..

one thing ive noticed is that internet creationists are far more worried about (3) and its consequences than anything else - whereas atheists really dont as a whole believe we have any answers to that yet.

the assumption is that it must be a physical process, no doubt, but the mechanisms are completely unknown and dont have anything to do with god anyway - why is the mechanism so important ?

[NapLajoieonSteroids]

Or it could be that everyone else besides us and the Turks are just wimps and will bow their heads to any expert which comes their way.

------------

To not have evolution requires an extensive cosmology

[noddy]

that is a very american viewpoint, the need to take a stance.

im more of the millitant agnostic - not only do i not know, i know nobody else knows either, so anybody thats too caught up in their opinion, is lying or kidding themselves.