Germany

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Heracleum Persicum
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Re: Germany

Post by Heracleum Persicum »

.


A United Nations committee has reprimanded Germany in strong language, saying that the country had violated an international anti-racism convention.


.


Ultimatum

CERD also issued an ultimatum to Germany, giving the country 90 days to inform the committee of the measures it will take to address the committee's opinion. It also recommended that the country "review its policies and procedures in cases of alleged racial discrimination" and widely distribute this information to prosecutors and judicial bodies.

"The opinion paper from the committee is at the Justice Ministry and will be reviewed," the government told the Der Tagesspiegel newspaper, which broke the story on Thursday.

The offending statements were made in an interview with the culture and political magazine Lettre International in September 2009, in which Sarrazin, also a former board member at Germany's central bank, disparaged Muslim immigrants, alleging that they "constantly produce little girls in headscarves" and were part of an "underclass that does not take part in the normal economic cycle." He also said that "a large number of Arabs and Turks in (Berlin) ... have no productive function other than in the fruit and vegetable trade."

The UN committee concluded that such statements "contain ideas of racial superiority, denying respect as human beings and depicting generalized negative characteristics of the Turkish population, as well as incitement to racial discrimination."

In 2010, Sarrazin repeated his sentiments in his controversial, best-selling book "Germany Does Itself In," which sparked a major debate about Muslims in the country.

.



Look, guys .. Europe same Europe as the good old days .. now, instead of beating on Mosche, they beatin on Mustafa Pasha


Ibrahim, don't be fooled .. let go of that EU rubbish .. look east .. you seein Ahamadinejat ? ? ? well, if you seein him, grab him, that is where your future lies

And

Ibrahim

let go of that silly game .. those Qatari monkey and Al Saud characters working for enemy .. get off their train



.
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Endovelico
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Re: Germany

Post by Endovelico »

Heracleum Persicum wrote:Look, guys .. Europe same Europe as the good old days .. now, instead of beating on Mosche, they beatin on Mustafa Pasha.
Not Europe. Just Germany and some of their Nordic cousins...
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monster_gardener
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Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2011 12:36 am
Location: Trolla. Land of upside down trees and tomatos........

Try Mustafa Kemal. Mustafa 911 Pasha is a VERY Bad Example..

Post by monster_gardener »

Heracleum Persicum wrote:.


A United Nations committee has reprimanded Germany in strong language, saying that the country had violated an international anti-racism convention.


.


Ultimatum

CERD also issued an ultimatum to Germany, giving the country 90 days to inform the committee of the measures it will take to address the committee's opinion. It also recommended that the country "review its policies and procedures in cases of alleged racial discrimination" and widely distribute this information to prosecutors and judicial bodies.

"The opinion paper from the committee is at the Justice Ministry and will be reviewed," the government told the Der Tagesspiegel newspaper, which broke the story on Thursday.

The offending statements were made in an interview with the culture and political magazine Lettre International in September 2009, in which Sarrazin, also a former board member at Germany's central bank, disparaged Muslim immigrants, alleging that they "constantly produce little girls in headscarves" and were part of an "underclass that does not take part in the normal economic cycle." He also said that "a large number of Arabs and Turks in (Berlin) ... have no productive function other than in the fruit and vegetable trade."

The UN committee concluded that such statements "contain ideas of racial superiority, denying respect as human beings and depicting generalized negative characteristics of the Turkish population, as well as incitement to racial discrimination."

In 2010, Sarrazin repeated his sentiments in his controversial, best-selling book "Germany Does Itself In," which sparked a major debate about Muslims in the country.

.



Look, guys .. Europe same Europe as the good old days .. now, instead of beating on Mosche, they beatin on Mustafa Pasha


Ibrahim, don't be fooled .. let go of that EU rubbish .. look east .. you seein Ahamadinejat ? ? ? well, if you seein him, grab him, that is where your future lies

And

Ibrahim

let go of that silly game .. those Qatari monkey and Al Saud characters working for enemy .. get off their train



.
Thank you Very Much for your post, Azari.
Europe same Europe as the good old days .. now, instead of beating on Mosche, instead of beating on Mosche, they beatin on Mustafa Pasha

Why would the Europeans want to beat on Mustafa Pasha? ;)

Could it be that Mustafa Pasha and a bunch of his buddies, an army of them in fact were beating on the Europeans? ;) :twisted: :evil:

As a matter of fact it was.......

Mustafa Pasha lead the Turkish invasion of Europe in 1683 and was stopped at the Gates of Vienna on SEPTEMBER 11, 1683!

Stopped by John Sobieski, the King of Poland!

What it boils down to is that Middle Easterners/Muslims are just as DEPRAVED SINFUL EGOTISTICAL CHAOS MONKEYS as are the Europeans.

And that when the Middle Easterners are/were powerful on par with the Europeans, they act/acted comparably as bad or worse in their own peculiar religious fanatic control freak way as Europeans did and do.
Merzifonlu Kara Mustafa Pasha (Born 1634/1635 – died 25 December 1683) was an Ottoman military leader and grand vizier who was a central character in the empire's last attempts at expansion into both Central Europe and Eastern Europe................

In 1683, he launched a campaign northward into Austria in a last effort to expand the Ottoman empire after more than 150 years of war. By mid-July, his 100,000-man army had besieged Vienna (guarded by 10,000 Habsburg soldiers), following in the footsteps of Suleiman the Magnificent in 1529. By September, he had taken a portion of the walls and appeared to be on his way to victory.

But on 12 September 1683, Polish army under King Jan Sobieski took advantage of dissent within the Turkish military command and poor disposition of his troops, winning the Battle of Vienna with a devastating flank attack led by Sobieski's Polish cavalry (Polish Hussars). The Turks retreated into Hungary, and then leaving the kingdom for retaking by the Austrians in 1686.

The defeat cost Mustafa his position, and ultimately, his life. On 25 December 1683, Kara Mustafa was executed in Belgrade at the order of Mehmed IV. He suffered death by strangulation with a silk cord which was the capital punishment inflicted on high-ranking persons in the Ottoman Empire. His last words were, in effect, "Make sure you tie the knot right." Mustafa's head was presented to Mehmed IV in a velvet bag.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kara_Mustafa_Pasha

Ibrahim, don't be fooled .. let go of that EU rubbish .. look east .. you seein Ahamadinejat ? ? ? well, if you seein him, grab him, that is where your future lies
Not so much........

Try some Mustafa Kemal Ataturk..........

"I wish all religion were at the bottom of the sea"........

If Turks felt that way, they might fit right in with the largely post Christian Euroz...
For the love of G_d, consider you & I may be mistaken.
Orion Must Rise: Killer Space Rocks Coming Our way
The Best Laid Plans of Men, Monkeys & Pigs Oft Go Awry
Woe to those who long for the Day of the Lord, for It is Darkness, Not Light
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Heracleum Persicum
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Joined: Sat Dec 22, 2012 7:38 pm

Re: Try Mustafa Kemal. Mustafa 911 Pasha is a VERY Bad Examp

Post by Heracleum Persicum »

monster_gardener wrote:
Heracleum Persicum wrote:.


A United Nations committee has reprimanded Germany in strong language, saying that the country had violated an international anti-racism convention.


.


Ultimatum

CERD also issued an ultimatum to Germany, giving the country 90 days to inform the committee of the measures it will take to address the committee's opinion. It also recommended that the country "review its policies and procedures in cases of alleged racial discrimination" and widely distribute this information to prosecutors and judicial bodies.

"The opinion paper from the committee is at the Justice Ministry and will be reviewed," the government told the Der Tagesspiegel newspaper, which broke the story on Thursday.

The offending statements were made in an interview with the culture and political magazine Lettre International in September 2009, in which Sarrazin, also a former board member at Germany's central bank, disparaged Muslim immigrants, alleging that they "constantly produce little girls in headscarves" and were part of an "underclass that does not take part in the normal economic cycle." He also said that "a large number of Arabs and Turks in (Berlin) ... have no productive function other than in the fruit and vegetable trade."

The UN committee concluded that such statements "contain ideas of racial superiority, denying respect as human beings and depicting generalized negative characteristics of the Turkish population, as well as incitement to racial discrimination."

In 2010, Sarrazin repeated his sentiments in his controversial, best-selling book "Germany Does Itself In," which sparked a major debate about Muslims in the country.

.



Look, guys .. Europe same Europe as the good old days .. now, instead of beating on Mosche, they beatin on Mustafa Pasha


Ibrahim, don't be fooled .. let go of that EU rubbish .. look east .. you seein Ahamadinejat ? ? ? well, if you seein him, grab him, that is where your future lies

And

Ibrahim

let go of that silly game .. those Qatari monkey and Al Saud characters working for enemy .. get off their train



.
Thank you Very Much for your post, Azari.
Europe same Europe as the good old days .. now, instead of beating on Mosche, instead of beating on Mosche, they beatin on Mustafa Pasha

Why would the Europeans want to beat on Mustafa Pasha? ;)

Could it be that Mustafa Pasha and a bunch of his buddies, an army of them in fact were beating on the Europeans? ;) :twisted: :evil:

As a matter of fact it was.......

Mustafa Pasha lead the Turkish invasion of Europe in 1683 and was stopped at the Gates of Vienna on SEPTEMBER 11, 1683!

Stopped by John Sobieski, the King of Poland!

What it boils down to is that Middle Easterners/Muslims are just as DEPRAVED SINFUL EGOTISTICAL CHAOS MONKEYS as are the Europeans.

And that when the Middle Easterners are/were powerful on par with the Europeans, they act/acted comparably as bad or worse in their own peculiar religious fanatic control freak way as Europeans did and do.
Merzifonlu Kara Mustafa Pasha (Born 1634/1635 – died 25 December 1683) was an Ottoman military leader and grand vizier who was a central character in the empire's last attempts at expansion into both Central Europe and Eastern Europe................

In 1683, he launched a campaign northward into Austria in a last effort to expand the Ottoman empire after more than 150 years of war. By mid-July, his 100,000-man army had besieged Vienna (guarded by 10,000 Habsburg soldiers), following in the footsteps of Suleiman the Magnificent in 1529. By September, he had taken a portion of the walls and appeared to be on his way to victory.

But on 12 September 1683, Polish army under King Jan Sobieski took advantage of dissent within the Turkish military command and poor disposition of his troops, winning the Battle of Vienna with a devastating flank attack led by Sobieski's Polish cavalry (Polish Hussars). The Turks retreated into Hungary, and then leaving the kingdom for retaking by the Austrians in 1686.

The defeat cost Mustafa his position, and ultimately, his life. On 25 December 1683, Kara Mustafa was executed in Belgrade at the order of Mehmed IV. He suffered death by strangulation with a silk cord which was the capital punishment inflicted on high-ranking persons in the Ottoman Empire. His last words were, in effect, "Make sure you tie the knot right." Mustafa's head was presented to Mehmed IV in a velvet bag.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kara_Mustafa_Pasha



Monster, you a modern day Don Quixote de la Mancha :lol: :lol: .. Still fighting the demons

Monster, believe or not, Middle East too has advanced .. tragedy is, you with the wrong crowed, your friends still same demons used 2B :)



monster_gardener wrote:
Heracleum Persicum wrote:.
Ibrahim, don't be fooled .. let go of that EU rubbish .. look east .. you seein Ahamadinejat ? ? ? well, if you seein him, grab him, that is where your future lies
Not so much........

Try some Mustafa Kemal Ataturk..........

"I wish all religion were at the bottom of the sea"........

If Turks felt that way, they might fit right in with the largely post Christian Euroz..

.

Poor Kamal Pasha, am sure he turning in his grave watching Erdogan in bed with Wahhabi and Islamist fighting traditional Turkish friend, secular Syrians .. Ataturk finished, the generals in prison



.
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monster_gardener
Posts: 5334
Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2011 12:36 am
Location: Trolla. Land of upside down trees and tomatos........

Re: Try Mustafa Kemal. Mustafa 911 Pasha is a VERY Bad Examp

Post by monster_gardener »

Heracleum Persicum wrote:
monster_gardener wrote:
Heracleum Persicum wrote:.


A United Nations committee has reprimanded Germany in strong language, saying that the country had violated an international anti-racism convention.


.


Ultimatum

CERD also issued an ultimatum to Germany, giving the country 90 days to inform the committee of the measures it will take to address the committee's opinion. It also recommended that the country "review its policies and procedures in cases of alleged racial discrimination" and widely distribute this information to prosecutors and judicial bodies.

"The opinion paper from the committee is at the Justice Ministry and will be reviewed," the government told the Der Tagesspiegel newspaper, which broke the story on Thursday.

The offending statements were made in an interview with the culture and political magazine Lettre International in September 2009, in which Sarrazin, also a former board member at Germany's central bank, disparaged Muslim immigrants, alleging that they "constantly produce little girls in headscarves" and were part of an "underclass that does not take part in the normal economic cycle." He also said that "a large number of Arabs and Turks in (Berlin) ... have no productive function other than in the fruit and vegetable trade."

The UN committee concluded that such statements "contain ideas of racial superiority, denying respect as human beings and depicting generalized negative characteristics of the Turkish population, as well as incitement to racial discrimination."

In 2010, Sarrazin repeated his sentiments in his controversial, best-selling book "Germany Does Itself In," which sparked a major debate about Muslims in the country.

.



Look, guys .. Europe same Europe as the good old days .. now, instead of beating on Mosche, they beatin on Mustafa Pasha


Ibrahim, don't be fooled .. let go of that EU rubbish .. look east .. you seein Ahamadinejat ? ? ? well, if you seein him, grab him, that is where your future lies

And

Ibrahim

let go of that silly game .. those Qatari monkey and Al Saud characters working for enemy .. get off their train



.
Thank you Very Much for your post, Azari.
Europe same Europe as the good old days .. now, instead of beating on Mosche, instead of beating on Mosche, they beatin on Mustafa Pasha

Why would the Europeans want to beat on Mustafa Pasha? ;)

Could it be that Mustafa Pasha and a bunch of his buddies, an army of them in fact were beating on the Europeans? ;) :twisted: :evil:

As a matter of fact it was.......

Mustafa Pasha lead the Turkish invasion of Europe in 1683 and was stopped at the Gates of Vienna on SEPTEMBER 11, 1683!

Stopped by John Sobieski, the King of Poland!

What it boils down to is that Middle Easterners/Muslims are just as DEPRAVED SINFUL EGOTISTICAL CHAOS MONKEYS as are the Europeans.

And that when the Middle Easterners are/were powerful on par with the Europeans, they act/acted comparably as bad or worse in their own peculiar religious fanatic control freak way as Europeans did and do.
Merzifonlu Kara Mustafa Pasha (Born 1634/1635 – died 25 December 1683) was an Ottoman military leader and grand vizier who was a central character in the empire's last attempts at expansion into both Central Europe and Eastern Europe................

In 1683, he launched a campaign northward into Austria in a last effort to expand the Ottoman empire after more than 150 years of war. By mid-July, his 100,000-man army had besieged Vienna (guarded by 10,000 Habsburg soldiers), following in the footsteps of Suleiman the Magnificent in 1529. By September, he had taken a portion of the walls and appeared to be on his way to victory.

But on 12 September 1683, Polish army under King Jan Sobieski took advantage of dissent within the Turkish military command and poor disposition of his troops, winning the Battle of Vienna with a devastating flank attack led by Sobieski's Polish cavalry (Polish Hussars). The Turks retreated into Hungary, and then leaving the kingdom for retaking by the Austrians in 1686.

The defeat cost Mustafa his position, and ultimately, his life. On 25 December 1683, Kara Mustafa was executed in Belgrade at the order of Mehmed IV. He suffered death by strangulation with a silk cord which was the capital punishment inflicted on high-ranking persons in the Ottoman Empire. His last words were, in effect, "Make sure you tie the knot right." Mustafa's head was presented to Mehmed IV in a velvet bag.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kara_Mustafa_Pasha



Monster, you a modern day Don Quixote de la Mancha :lol: :lol: .. Still fighting the demons

Monster, believe or not, Middle East too has advanced .. tragedy is, you with the wrong crowed, your friends still same demons used 2B :)



monster_gardener wrote:
Heracleum Persicum wrote:.
Ibrahim, don't be fooled .. let go of that EU rubbish .. look east .. you seein Ahamadinejat ? ? ? well, if you seein him, grab him, that is where your future lies
Not so much........

Try some Mustafa Kemal Ataturk..........

"I wish all religion were at the bottom of the sea"........

If Turks felt that way, they might fit right in with the largely post Christian Euroz..

.

Poor Kamal Pasha, am sure he turning in his grave watching Erdogan in bed with Wahhabi and Islamist fighting traditional Turkish friend, secular Syrians .. Ataturk finished, the generals in prison



.
Thank You Very Much for your post, Azari.
Monster, you a modern day Don Quixote de la Mancha :lol: :lol: .. Still fighting the demons
You may be close to correct......

Maybe a fallen angel standing on the Slopes of Vesuvius near Pompeii, telling people to leave town NOW!

Or a fireman at the door of a burning room filled with fighting feral cats trying to shoo some out the door knowing that probably at best I will be able to get just a very few out and may end up dying doing that........
Still fighting the demons
Perhaps.... But perhaps just Depraved Sinful Egotistical Chaos Monkey Humans.....

Monster, believe or not, Middle East too has advanced ..
I hope so, Azari.
Build them Orion Rustam Rockets, Azari.
Build them right
Laydown a Space Elevator
Get a remnant off Earth before it dies...........

Poor Kamal Pasha, am sure he turning in his grave watching Erdogan in bed with Wahhabi and Islamist fighting traditional Turkish friend, secular Syrians ..
Seconded.
For the love of G_d, consider you & I may be mistaken.
Orion Must Rise: Killer Space Rocks Coming Our way
The Best Laid Plans of Men, Monkeys & Pigs Oft Go Awry
Woe to those who long for the Day of the Lord, for It is Darkness, Not Light
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Typhoon
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Re: Germany

Post by Typhoon »

Die Welt | How Germany Beats the Youth Unemployment Trap
The "dual" vocational training system used to be derided as limiting university degrees. Now it is being lauded in the U.S., and exported to struggling southern European countries.
May the gods preserve and defend me from self-righteous altruists; I can defend myself from my enemies and my friends.
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Azrael
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Re: Germany

Post by Azrael »

I agree. And it gives blue color workers self respect and pride in their workmanship, which increases productivity.
cultivate a white rose
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Endovelico
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Re: Germany

Post by Endovelico »

Opera Cancels Holocaust Staging of 'Tannhäuser'

A staging of Richard Wagner's "Tannhäuser" -- set during the Holocaust and including a gas chamber and a shooting scene -- shocked audience members so badly that some had to be given medical attention. The theater has now cancelled the production out of fear it will damage its artistic reputation.

Düsseldorf's Deutsche Oper am Rhein opera house announced late Wednesday it was cancelling a highly controversial staging of Richard Wagner's "Tannhäuser" after outraging audiences at its premier on Saturday.

Director Burkhard Kosminski set the production in the time of the Nazi regime in an effort to address the controversial but popular composer's anti-Semitism and the later influence he would have on Nazi ideology. The staging depicted the character Tannhäuser as a Nazi war criminal and it even included a gas chamber on stage.

In a statement released on Thursday, the Deutsche Oper am Rhein said its managers had been conscious ahead of the premier that the production would be controversial. "We are reacting with the utmost concern to the fact that a few scenes, particularly one involving a very realistic depiction of a shooting scene, appears to have created such a strong stress for numerous visitors, both psychological and physical, that they had to receive medical attention afterwards."

The theater said that after "intensive discussions," director Kosminski, also a well-known German actor, refused to tone down his staging and that the opera must respect his artistic freedom, also for "legal reasons".

"After considering all the arguments, we have come to the conclusion that we cannot justify such an extreme impact of our artistic work," the statement read. The controversy is the biggest ever faced by the Düsseldorf opera house, which is not traditionally known for productions that have caused outrage.

Kosminski said he was "shocked" by the theater's decision and that he had simply been informed by the opera's management. "I presented my plan 10 months ago and explained what I wanted to do," he told the Westdeutsche Zeitung newspaper. "I also established a great deal of transparency during rehearsals. I am not a scandalous director and I have already staged more than 50 productions."

Gas Chambers and a Brutal Shooting Scene

Among the staging's most shocking scenes is a sequence during the famous "Tannhäuser" overture, in which nude actors are lowered to the floor on a cross made of glass cubes that are slowly filled with fog to represent the gas chambers. The Venusberg, the site of hedonistic love in Wagner's opera, becomes the site of a brutal shooting scene. Venus, who is decked out in a Nazi uniform, and her SS henchmen murder a family and then force Tannhäuser to kill as well.

With that kind of sensitive material, it didn't take long for the booing to begin. The theater reported that some guests also required medical attention. Following the outrage of theater-goers and the public, Rheinoper officials moved four days after the premier to suspend the staging. The opera will continue, but only with the orchestra and the singers and none of the elaborate props.

There had been no public demands to stop the production, but the theater decided to do so anyway. The leader of the Düsseldorf Jewish community, Michael Szentei-Heise described the production as "tasteless," but said he did not see the need to stop it, according to German news agency DPA. Wagner may have been a "fervent anti-Semite," but he didn't have anything to do with the Holocaust, he said.

Meanwhile, the Central Council of Jews in Germany said it had taken note of the controversial production but did not issue any comment.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/zei ... 98937.html
Germans like to think they are smarter than most other peoples. But how smart can a people be who makes such an incredible idiocy? How many people had to agree to such a stupid thing, in order to make it possible? This isn't a case of poor judgement by an individual, it's a collective act of imbecility. No wonder Merkel does the things she does...
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monster_gardener
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Location: Trolla. Land of upside down trees and tomatos........

Kill Da Wagner

Post by monster_gardener »

Endovelico wrote:
Opera Cancels Holocaust Staging of 'Tannhäuser'

A staging of Richard Wagner's "Tannhäuser" -- set during the Holocaust and including a gas chamber and a shooting scene -- shocked audience members so badly that some had to be given medical attention. The theater has now cancelled the production out of fear it will damage its artistic reputation.

Düsseldorf's Deutsche Oper am Rhein opera house announced late Wednesday it was cancelling a highly controversial staging of Richard Wagner's "Tannhäuser" after outraging audiences at its premier on Saturday.

Director Burkhard Kosminski set the production in the time of the Nazi regime in an effort to address the controversial but popular composer's anti-Semitism and the later influence he would have on Nazi ideology. The staging depicted the character Tannhäuser as a Nazi war criminal and it even included a gas chamber on stage.

In a statement released on Thursday, the Deutsche Oper am Rhein said its managers had been conscious ahead of the premier that the production would be controversial. "We are reacting with the utmost concern to the fact that a few scenes, particularly one involving a very realistic depiction of a shooting scene, appears to have created such a strong stress for numerous visitors, both psychological and physical, that they had to receive medical attention afterwards."

The theater said that after "intensive discussions," director Kosminski, also a well-known German actor, refused to tone down his staging and that the opera must respect his artistic freedom, also for "legal reasons".

"After considering all the arguments, we have come to the conclusion that we cannot justify such an extreme impact of our artistic work," the statement read. The controversy is the biggest ever faced by the Düsseldorf opera house, which is not traditionally known for productions that have caused outrage.

Kosminski said he was "shocked" by the theater's decision and that he had simply been informed by the opera's management. "I presented my plan 10 months ago and explained what I wanted to do," he told the Westdeutsche Zeitung newspaper. "I also established a great deal of transparency during rehearsals. I am not a scandalous director and I have already staged more than 50 productions."

Gas Chambers and a Brutal Shooting Scene

Among the staging's most shocking scenes is a sequence during the famous "Tannhäuser" overture, in which nude actors are lowered to the floor on a cross made of glass cubes that are slowly filled with fog to represent the gas chambers. The Venusberg, the site of hedonistic love in Wagner's opera, becomes the site of a brutal shooting scene. Venus, who is decked out in a Nazi uniform, and her SS henchmen murder a family and then force Tannhäuser to kill as well.

With that kind of sensitive material, it didn't take long for the booing to begin. The theater reported that some guests also required medical attention. Following the outrage of theater-goers and the public, Rheinoper officials moved four days after the premier to suspend the staging. The opera will continue, but only with the orchestra and the singers and none of the elaborate props.

There had been no public demands to stop the production, but the theater decided to do so anyway. The leader of the Düsseldorf Jewish community, Michael Szentei-Heise described the production as "tasteless," but said he did not see the need to stop it, according to German news agency DPA. Wagner may have been a "fervent anti-Semite," but he didn't have anything to do with the Holocaust, he said.

Meanwhile, the Central Council of Jews in Germany said it had taken note of the controversial production but did not issue any comment.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/zei ... 98937.html
Germans like to think they are smarter than most other peoples. But how smart can a people be who makes such an incredible idiocy? How many people had to agree to such a stupid thing, in order to make it possible? This isn't a case of poor judgement by an individual, it's a collective act of imbecility. No wonder Merkel does the things she does...
Thank You Very Much for your post, Endo.

I'm going to give the Germans points for confronting past sins.

Plus bonus points for gratuitous nudity fan service ;)

Additionally Wagner can sometimes be GREAT source material for producing derivative parody works like this outstanding cartoon.

nI9Nbt7oJG0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nI9Nbt7oJG0

Whenever I hear the "Ride of the Valkyries", I hear "Kill Da Wabbit!" ;) :lol:
For the love of G_d, consider you & I may be mistaken.
Orion Must Rise: Killer Space Rocks Coming Our way
The Best Laid Plans of Men, Monkeys & Pigs Oft Go Awry
Woe to those who long for the Day of the Lord, for It is Darkness, Not Light
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Azrael
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Re: Germany

Post by Azrael »

Endovelico wrote:
Opera Cancels Holocaust Staging of 'Tannhäuser'

A staging of Richard Wagner's "Tannhäuser" -- set during the Holocaust and including a gas chamber and a shooting scene -- shocked audience members so badly that some had to be given medical attention. The theater has now cancelled the production out of fear it will damage its artistic reputation.

Düsseldorf's Deutsche Oper am Rhein opera house announced late Wednesday it was cancelling a highly controversial staging of Richard Wagner's "Tannhäuser" after outraging audiences at its premier on Saturday.

Director Burkhard Kosminski set the production in the time of the Nazi regime in an effort to address the controversial but popular composer's anti-Semitism and the later influence he would have on Nazi ideology. The staging depicted the character Tannhäuser as a Nazi war criminal and it even included a gas chamber on stage.

In a statement released on Thursday, the Deutsche Oper am Rhein said its managers had been conscious ahead of the premier that the production would be controversial. "We are reacting with the utmost concern to the fact that a few scenes, particularly one involving a very realistic depiction of a shooting scene, appears to have created such a strong stress for numerous visitors, both psychological and physical, that they had to receive medical attention afterwards."

The theater said that after "intensive discussions," director Kosminski, also a well-known German actor, refused to tone down his staging and that the opera must respect his artistic freedom, also for "legal reasons".

"After considering all the arguments, we have come to the conclusion that we cannot justify such an extreme impact of our artistic work," the statement read. The controversy is the biggest ever faced by the Düsseldorf opera house, which is not traditionally known for productions that have caused outrage.

Kosminski said he was "shocked" by the theater's decision and that he had simply been informed by the opera's management. "I presented my plan 10 months ago and explained what I wanted to do," he told the Westdeutsche Zeitung newspaper. "I also established a great deal of transparency during rehearsals. I am not a scandalous director and I have already staged more than 50 productions."

Gas Chambers and a Brutal Shooting Scene

Among the staging's most shocking scenes is a sequence during the famous "Tannhäuser" overture, in which nude actors are lowered to the floor on a cross made of glass cubes that are slowly filled with fog to represent the gas chambers. The Venusberg, the site of hedonistic love in Wagner's opera, becomes the site of a brutal shooting scene. Venus, who is decked out in a Nazi uniform, and her SS henchmen murder a family and then force Tannhäuser to kill as well.

With that kind of sensitive material, it didn't take long for the booing to begin. The theater reported that some guests also required medical attention. Following the outrage of theater-goers and the public, Rheinoper officials moved four days after the premier to suspend the staging. The opera will continue, but only with the orchestra and the singers and none of the elaborate props.

There had been no public demands to stop the production, but the theater decided to do so anyway. The leader of the Düsseldorf Jewish community, Michael Szentei-Heise described the production as "tasteless," but said he did not see the need to stop it, according to German news agency DPA. Wagner may have been a "fervent anti-Semite," but he didn't have anything to do with the Holocaust, he said.

Meanwhile, the Central Council of Jews in Germany said it had taken note of the controversial production but did not issue any comment.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/zei ... 98937.html
Germans like to think they are smarter than most other peoples. But how smart can a people be who makes such an incredible idiocy?
Good point. When I read the article I thought it belonged in the Onion, rather than a news site. This is monumentally stupid.

What's next? "Romeo and Juliet" set in the Holocaust where Romeo is a concentration camp guard and Juliet is Anne Frank?
How many people had to agree to such a stupid thing, in order to make it possible?
Quite a few. In Germany they do everything by committee. Even sex.
This isn't a case of poor judgement by an individual, it's a collective act of imbecility. No wonder Merkel does the things she does...
Poor Merkel is probably too busy preparing to try out for the role of Juliet to do her day job properly.
cultivate a white rose
Simple Minded

Re: Germany

Post by Simple Minded »

I've heard more than a few artistias claim that the job of the artist is to "shock" or "irritate" society. Even Babs Streisand IIRC.

Except of course for those who want to make money at their craft, those selfish bastards try to please their audiences.

These guys just underestimated their presentation skills. Feedback loops are great.
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Alexis
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Re: Germany

Post by Alexis »

Simple Minded wrote:I've heard more than a few artistias claim that the job of the artist is to "shock" or "irritate" society.
Precisely.

This looks to me more as such an artist going into overdrive about "reminding past sins" to his country, as shockingly as possible, than as the manifestation of a specific German lack of sensitivity to others.

To say it more simply: you don't have to be German to be a pretentious semi-"artist".
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Heracleum Persicum
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Re: Germany

Post by Heracleum Persicum »

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Greek government has compiled an 80-page report on both reparations and the repayment of the loan.



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It is classified but based on previous estimations, Athens could be demanding as much as 162bn euros (£137bn; $213bn): 108bn euros for destroyed infrastructure and 54bn for the loan. The state legal council is now deciding whether to pass it to Berlin.

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Wars called "World War 1 & 2" .. were wars between colonial powers fighting for other people's resources

They were no "world wars", they were European (and Imperial Japan wanted other people's natural resources too) wars

In that sense, all nations and countries that had nothing to do with "colonial resource steeling" and huge destruction and genocides were inflicted on them, must be compensated by those beast fighting each other

Iran suffered Trillions of dollars destruction, millions of people died .. Iran demanding Trillion of dollars compensation from west .. this officially confirmed




.
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Heracleum Persicum
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Re: Germany

Post by Heracleum Persicum »

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Germany should take-in the whistleblower on humanitarian grounds.
Many believe it should, but politicians fear the consequences.




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"Latin America is telling this young man that you are being persecuted by the empire, come here," Maduro said. Asked whether Snowden had tried to contact him by phone, the Venezuelen president said he had not, but said he would welcome a call.

[..]



' There Is a Way to Bring Snowden to Germany '

Meanwhile, in Germany, where Snowden exposed cooperation between US and German intelligence agencies whom he said were "in bed together," the debate over whether Berlin should find a way to offer Snowden asylum continues to simmer.

In a strongly worded text in its current issue, SPIEGEL asks, "Would it not be an act of humanity to liberate him from his current state by, for example, offering him asylum in Germany?" SPIEGEL writes that Snowden could get to Germany from Moscow within a day -- a stamp and a signature would suffice for Snowden to board the next plane to Germany and apply for asylum here.

The magazine notes that German border guards could reject him, but they aren't required to. More likely is that Snowden would immediately be taken into custody because the US has filed a formal request for extradition. The federal government, however, could intervene. Either way, a court would step in to review whether the American request could be fulfilled.

Experienced judges who deal with such situations on a regular basis are almost certain, SPIEGEL reports, that the request for extradition would be rejected as invalid because the extradition treaty between Germany and the United States forbids the transfer of people who are wanted for political crimes. According to Nikolaos Gazeas, an expert on international law at the University of Cologne, the German interpretation of treason is that it is a political offense.

Still, as SPIEGEL points out, "there is a way to bring Edward Snowden to Germany and to let him stay here. One just has to be willing to do it and to accept the subsequent fury of the Americans."

But there's a not a willingeness to do so. "At the moment," the magazine writes, "realpolitik means knuckling under to the Americans because Germany is politically and economically dependent on the US and economically on the Chinese, which is why there is little objection from Berlin on the issue of human rights. Germany is a country that doesn't dare anything. The Snowden case also shows that Germany is a dwarf when it comes to world affairs."

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Komm, Angela, komm

Zeig hast Eier :lol: :lol:



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Heracleum Persicum
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Re: Germany

Post by Heracleum Persicum »

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“There’s nothing wrong about telling the truth,” said Janina Cieply, 22, an anthropology student at Berlin’s Free University.
“It looks like the NSA picked up where the Stasi left off. Of course this is a delicate topic in Germany, and rightfully so. It’s the government’s duty to protect the people from such attacks.”




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Mindful of state surveillance by the Stasi under communism and the Gestapo under the Nazis, Germans are more sensitive than people in other nations to the powers of surveillance by government agencies.

Communist East Germany’s Staatssicherheit, or Stasi secret police, was the regime’s enforcer whose motto was “Shield and Sword of the Party.” The Stasi had 93,000 full-time agents and at least 189,000 part-time informers in 1989, the year the Berlin Wall fell before the 1990 German reunification, Joerg Drieselmann, director of Berlin’s Stasi Museum, said in a phone interview. East Germany had a population of about 16.4 million in 1989.
‘Collective Memory’

“The Stasi is the ultimate expression of spying in Germany’s collective memory,” he said.

Drieselmann said 120 kilometers (75 miles) of Stasi files still exist and that this is thought to be 65 percent to 70 percent of the total files before the Stasi’s frantic shredding and burning of its archives shortly before the communist state’s collapse.

“We still can’t compare the Stasi with the NSA,” he said. “I certainly don’t want to even try to compare them as institutions but let’s be clear: the NSA has gathered vastly more information than the Stasi ever did.”

In an interview with Die Zeit newspaper published yesterday, Merkel said she rejects any parallel between the Stasi and espionage practices of democratic states.
Spy Drama

The Stasi legacy still resonates and was dramatized in a film “The Lives of Others,” about an agent spying on a writer and his lover, which won an Oscar for Best Foreign Language Film in 2007.

Germany has a long tradition of data protection laws dating back to the 1970s. The state of Hesse introduced the first data protection law worldwide in 1970, according the Hesse State Commissioner for Data Protection website.

In 1983, the country’s top court said Germany’s constitution grants individuals a right to “informational self-determination.” A system “in which citizens can no longer know who knows what and when and on which occasion about them,” is incompatible with the constitution, the judges ruled. As a result, data can’t be collected without authorization under a law that determines and limits the scope and purpose.

Stasi and Nazi abuses which were followed by this legal framework lead many Germans to react strongly to data security violations.

“I think it’s a catastrophe that this is possible in this supposed free world,” said Josef Geuecke, 50, a farmer. “We have to try to stop this at all levels. We’ve become very sensitive after 1945, but that’s our duty.”
Exclusion Risks

Yet Jan Techau, head of the Carnegie Endowment’s Brussels office, said the German government is unlikely to heed the call of some members of the public and politicians in Berlin to trim back data exchanges with the U.S.

“German intelligence would lose access to American intelligence which has been useful in the past,” Techau said in a phone interview. “It would catapult Germany outside of America’s privileged inner circle. Sure, there’s a certain amount of hysteria and over-reaction in Germany but you can’t just dismiss this because there is a breach of trust.”

German industry, reliant for its exports on a technological edge over products made in lower-cost countries, is concerned the snooping may damage its competitiveness.
Play ‘Hardball’

“Berlin should invest heavily in cyberdefense and anti-espionage activities, give more resources to its intelligence agencies and join in the game of hardball,” Markus Kerber, the Federation of German Industry’s director general, wrote in an opinion piece in the Financial Times. “In a world of realpolitik, only the strong are taken seriously.”

The U.S. Patriot Act allows authorities to demand punctual access to information from U.S. companies. Reports leaked by Snowden said the NSA has been able to access servers of Google Inc., Facebook Inc., Apple Inc., Microsoft Corp. and others at any time since 2007. Other leaks pointed to the U.K.’s GCHQ tapping into and analyzing data from fiber-optic cables carrying Internet traffic, as well the U.S. bugging EU offices in Washington.

“When someone tells the truth like that, our government should protect him,” said Norbert Mayer, a 66-year-old retiree from Frankfurt. “But we’re clearly governed from Brussels and Washington. And it seems like even Merkel has no choice but to give in to Obama.”

Kuhlmann, the former Berlin Wall border guard, said intelligence gathering today in democracies takes place under totally different -- and much higher -- standards than what he knew in the East Bloc under communism.

“Spies exist in every nation and today we need to keep close watch on terrorists and organized crime,” he said. “But we learned in East Germany that spying must be controlled and in this case it doesn’t seem like it was.”

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come on, Angela, come on





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Heracleum Persicum
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Re: Germany

Post by Heracleum Persicum »

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XKeyScore




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Angela Merkel and her ministers claim they first learned about the US government's comprehensive spying programs from press reports. But SPIEGEL has learned that German intelligence services themselves use one of the NSA's most valuable tools.

Germany's foreign intelligence service, the BND, and its domestic intelligence agency, the Federal Office for the Protection of the Constitution (BfV), used a spying program of the American National Security Agency (NSA). This is evident in secret documents from the US intelligence service that have been seen by SPIEGEL journalists. The documents show that the Office for the Protection of the Constitution was equipped with a program called XKeyScore intended to "expand their ability to support NSA as we jointly prosecute CT (counterterrorism) targets." The BND is tasked with instructing the domestic intelligence agency on how to use the program, the documents say.

According to an internal NSA presentation from 2008, the program is a productive espionage tool. Starting with the metadata -- or information about which data connections were made and when -- it is able, for instance, to retroactively reveal any terms the target person has typed into a search engine, the documents show. In addition, the system is able to receive a "full take" of all unfiltered data over a period of several days -- including, at least in part, the content of communications.

This is relevant from a German perspective, because the documents show that of the up to 500 million data connections from Germany accessed monthly by the NSA, a major part is collected with XKeyScore (for instance, around 180 million in December 2012). The BND and BfV, when contacted by SPIEGEL, would not discuss the espionage tool. The NSA, as well, declined to comment, referring instead to the words of US President Barack Obama during his visit to Berlin and saying there was nothing to add.

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Angela, please turn the light off on the way out :lol: :lol:






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Torchwood
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Re: Germany

Post by Torchwood »

Angela Merkel visits the UK to tell Cameron that he will not get any EU competences "repatriated", and if he doesn't like it, well he can go screw himself and the Conservative party.
As the UK is not in Schengen, she has to go through immigration

"Name?" "Angela Merkel"
"Occupation?" "No, just visiting this time"
Hoosiernorm
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Re: Germany

Post by Hoosiernorm »

Torchwood wrote:Angela Merkel visits the UK to tell Cameron that he will not get any EU competences "repatriated", and if he doesn't like it, well he can go screw himself and the Conservative party.
As the UK is not in Schengen, she has to go through immigration

"Name?" "Angela Merkel"
"Occupation?" "No, just visiting this time"
:lol: :lol:
Been busy doing stuff
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Typhoon
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Re: Germany

Post by Typhoon »

Hoosiernorm wrote:
Torchwood wrote:Angela Merkel visits the UK to tell Cameron that he will not get any EU competences "repatriated", and if he doesn't like it, well he can go screw himself and the Conservative party.
As the UK is not in Schengen, she has to go through immigration

"Name?" "Angela Merkel"
"Occupation?" "No, just visiting this time"
:lol: :lol:
Seconded.
May the gods preserve and defend me from self-righteous altruists; I can defend myself from my enemies and my friends.
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Alexis
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Re: Germany

Post by Alexis »

Torchwood wrote:Angela Merkel visits the UK to tell Cameron that he will not get any EU competences "repatriated", and if he doesn't like it, well he can go screw himself and the Conservative party.
As the UK is not in Schengen, she has to go through immigration

"Name?" "Angela Merkel"
"Occupation?" "No, just visiting this time"
Good one, Herr Torchwood!

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Endovelico
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Germany

Post by Endovelico »

Germany Dozes on a Volcano
By Jürgen Habermas

Angela Merkel's government is forcing Southern Europe to undertake profound reforms while at the same time denying its own responsibility for the consequences of its crisis policies. Germany is risking a historic failure with its shortsighted wrangling.

Under the imploring headline "We Germans Don't Want a German Europe," German Finance Minister Wolfgang Schäuble recently denied in a newspaper essay published simultaneously in Great Britain, France, Poland, Italy and Spain that Germany seeks a political leadership role in the European Union. Schäuble who, along with Labor Minister Ursula von der Leyen, is the only remaining member of Chancellor Angela Merkel's cabinet who can be characterized as a "European" in the West German mold, speaks from conviction. He is anything but a revisionist seeking to reverse Germany's integration into Europe, thereby destroying the basis for the stability of the postwar order. He is familiar with the problem that Germans must fear should it ever return.

After the founding of the German Empire in 1871, Germany assumed a calamitous and partly hegemonic position, which, in the words of the deceased historian Ludwig Dehios, was "too weak to dominate the Continent but too strong to bring itself into line." This too helped pave the way for the disasters of the 20th century. Thanks to successful postwar European unification, both a divided Germany and a united Germany were prevented from stumbling into the same, old dilemma. It is clearly in Germany's interest that this state of affairs remains the same. But hasn't the situation changed?

Schäuble is reacting to a current threat. He is the one who is pushing through Merkel's stubborn course in Brussels and who can feel the cracks that could lead to the breakup of Europe's core. He is the one who, when meeting with finance ministers from the European Monetary Union, encounters the resistance of the "recipient countries" whenever he blocks renewed attempts to bring about a change in policy. The obstruction of a banking union, which would mutualize the costs associated with winding down ailing banks, is only the most recent example.

Schäuble doesn't stray so much as a millimeter from the chancellor's stipulation that German taxpayers not be burdened with more than exactly the scope of lending commitments that the financial markets demand for a rescue of the euro -- and that they have always received, as the consequence of an openly investor-friendly "bailout policy." Naturally, this rigidly pursued course does not rule out a gesture of €100 million ($133 million) for loans to small and mid-sized businesses, which the rich uncle from Berlin recently handed to the stricken cousins in Athens from the national bank vault.

A Duplicitous Game

The fact is that the Merkel administration is forcing its controversial crisis agenda on France and the "southern countries," while the purchasing policy of the European Central Bank (ECB) provides unacknowledged support. At the same time, however, Germany denies Europe-wide responsibility for the effects of its crisis policy -- a responsibility it tacitly assumes by taking on this (some would say, perfectly normal) role as a leading power. Just think of the horrendous youth unemployment in Southern Europe as one of the consequences of an austerity policy that weighs most heavily on the weakest members of those societies.

When seen in this light, the message "we don't want a German Europe" can also be interpreted in a less favorable way, namely that Germany is shirking its responsibility. Formally speaking, the European Council reaches decisions by unanimous vote. As only one of 18 members of the Monetary Union, Merkel can uninhibitedly pursue national interests, or at least that which she believes to be such. The German government derives a benefit from the country's economic preponderance, even a disproportionately large benefit, for as long as its partners don't begin to question the Germans' politically unambitious loyalty to Europe.

But how can a gesture of humility seem credible given the appearance of a policy that unabashedly takes advantage of the country's own economic and demographic preponderance? When, for example, tougher emissions rules for the nouveau-riche ostentation of luxury sedans -- entirely in the spirit of the federal government's shift away from nuclear power and toward green energy -- threaten to adversely affect the German automobile industry, the vote in Brussels is postponed, following the chancellor's intervention, until the lobby is satisfied or the parliamentary election is over. It seems to me that Schäuble's article addresses the frustrations triggered by Berlin's duplicitous game among leaders of the other euro-zone member states.

Fictional Sovereignty

In the name of market imperatives to which there is allegedly no alternative, an increasingly isolated German government is enforcing harsh austerity policies in France and those euro-zone countries gripped by crisis. Contrary to reality, it assumes that all members of the European monetary union can make their own decisions regarding budgetary and economic policy. They are expected to "modernize" their administration and economy, and to enhance their competitiveness on their own -- if necessary with aid loans from the rescue fund.

This fiction of sovereignty is convenient for Germany, because it saves the stronger partner from having to take into account the negative effects that some policies can have on weaker partners. It is a situation that European Central Bank President Mario Draghi warned about a year ago, saying that "it is neither sustainable nor legitimate for countries to pursue national policies that can cause economic harm for others" (Die Zeit, Aug. 30, 2012).

It's worth repeating again and again: The suboptimal conditions under which the European Monetary Union operates today are the result of a design flaw, namely that the political union was never completed. That's why pushing the problems onto the shoulders of the crisis-ridden countries with credit financing isn't the answer. The imposition of austerity policies cannot correct the existing economic imbalances in the euro zone. An assimilation of the different levels in productivity in the mid-term could only be expected from a joint, or at least closely coordinated, fiscal, economic and social policy. And if we then, in the course of countervailing policies, don't wish to completely turn into a technocracy, we must ask the public what they think about a democratic core Europe. Wolfgang Schäuble knows this. He says as much in SPIEGEL interviews, which, however, have no consequences for his political behavior.

European policy is in a trap that the political sociologist Claus Offe has sharply illuminated: If we do not want to give up the monetary union, an institutional reform, which takes time, is both necessary and unpopular. This is why politicians who hope to be re-elected are kicking the can down the road. The German government, in particular, is in a double bind, because it has already assumed pan-European responsibility through its actions. It is also the only government that can take a promising initiative for a step forward -- and should pursue France's support for such a process. It isn't a trifling project, after all, but one into which Europe's most prominent politicians have invested their best efforts for more than half a century.

Politicians Should Come Clean

On the other hand, what exactly does "unpopular" mean? If a political solution is sensible, it should be reasonable to ask a democratic electorate to accept it. And when should one do so, if not before a parliamentary election? Anything else is patronizing deception. It is always a mistake to underestimate and ask too little of voters. I consider it a historical failure of the political elites in Germany if they continue to shut their eyes and behave as if it were business as usual -- that is, if they persist in their shortsighted wrangling over the fine print behind closed doors, which is the current approach.

Instead, politicians should come clean with the increasingly restless citizenry, which has never been confronted with substantial European issues. They should take the lead in an inevitably polarizing dispute over alternatives, none of which is available for free. And they should no longer remain silent about the negative redistribution effects, which the "donor countries," in their own long-term interest, must accept in the short and medium term as the only constructive solution to the crisis.

We know Angela Merkel's response: soporific bumbling. Her public persona seems to lack any normative core. Since the Greek crisis erupted in May 2010 and Merkel's Christian Democrats lost the state election in North Rhine-Westphalia, she has subordinated each of her considered steps to the opportunism of staying in power. Since then, the clever chancellor has maneuvered around with a clear mind but without recognizable principles, and, for the second time, is depriving the federal election of any controversial issue, not to mention her carefully isolated European policy. She can shape the agenda, because the opposition, were it to press on the subject of Europe, would be battered with the "debt union" cudgel -- by the same people who could only agree were they to say anything at all.

Europe is in a state of emergency, and the political power goes to whoever decides on the admission or licensing of topics to be discussed by the public. Germany isn't dancing. It's dozing on a volcano.

Are the elites failing? Every democratic country has the politicians it deserves. And there is something peculiar about expecting behavior beyond the routine from elected politicians. I'm happy to have been living in a country which, since 1945, has had no need for heroes. I also don't believe in the statement that individuals make history, at least not in general. But I do realize that there are extraordinary situations in which cognitive sensitivity, imagination, courage and willingness to take responsibility of those in charge have an impact on the progression of things.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/ger ... 15244.html
I could dispute some things Habermas says here, but it is a well thought text which should be carefully read.
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Azrael
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Re: Germany

Post by Azrael »

It seems that Germany makes catastrophic strategic miscalculations. World War I was avoidable. Another two front war in World War II was a disaster.

I think that even the Franco-Prussian War was a huge miscalculation, since it made Germany not strong enough to dominate Europe, while making it strong enough to have other European states consider it a huge danger and form a coalition against it. The German states could have just formed a defensive alliance against France.
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Torchwood
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Re: Germany

Post by Torchwood »

The disaster that is German energy policy

Who says that Europe has no religious fundamentalism? We have the German Greens!
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Heracleum Persicum
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Re: Germany

Post by Heracleum Persicum »

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Looks like Angela, CDU, won absolute majority in the election


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Torchwood
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Re: Germany

Post by Torchwood »

Heracleum Persicum wrote:.


Looks like Angela, CDU, won absolute majority in the election


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latest projection is 4 seats short - but preferred partner the FDP has failed to get the minimum 5% needed to get into Parliament.
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