agreed though not on the details........... brought Gold, Frankenstein , and Myrrh to Baby Jesus and used Franky the Flesh Golem 
to make Herod* the Half Edomite Killer Ape King" an offer he could not refuse" 
and some ho ho/hoes 
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According to Iranian mythology, from Yalda night forward, days grow longer. This celebration, based on the Iranian calendar, comes in the Persian month of Day, named after the pre-Zoroastrian god of creation and light (Deity).
Yalda has a root in Zoroastrian belief, to be exact, Mithraism religion. The Mithraists believed that Mithra, the Persian god of light and truth, was born to a virgin mother in the morning of the longest night of the year, symbolizing the Sun god overcoming the powers of darkness.
Having the belief, ancient Iranians gathered in caves throughout the night to witness this miracle together at dawn. They were known as 'Yar-e Ghar' (Cave Mates).
According to some beliefs narrated in Persian poetry, many unpleasant events such as the separation between loved ones, loneliness and waiting would be over after Yalda Night (dubbed Shab-e Yalda or Shab-e Chelleh in Persian).
[..]
Fruits, particularly pomegranates and watermelons, and nuts are served in this night. The fruits signify the hope for having a fruitful spring and summer.
The red-colored fruits are believed to symbolize the crimson hues of dawn and glow of life, invoking the glory of Mithra. Pomegranates with angelica powder are also believed to protect individuals against the Devil.
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Marcus wrote:The notion is silly as I see it. All men are born with the law of God/Moral law/Natural law written into their DNA . . the "maker's mark" as it were.
And all religions, however ancient, contain that law in some form or another, however refined, however explicit.
But to go from there to some sort of "progression" [i.e., "this thus that"] is a bridge too far.
The Law of God, if such it is, is progressive revelation, progressive in the sense of our ability to apprehend and apply it.
I've read that according to Christian tradition the three wise men, Caspar, Balthasar, and Melchior, each represented a foreign group that the first Christian churches were founded in. One of them did represent the Pomegranates/Zoroastrians, though not all three.Enki wrote:The three wisemen were Zoroastrians as far as I could tell.
Ahh, when I learned of Zoroastrianism, it just seemed like the perfect fit, the three wise men and zoroastrianism vibed at the same frequency. But yeah, they were supposed to be from different places, just travelling together.Ibrahim wrote:I've read that according to Christian tradition the three wise men, Caspar, Balthasar, and Melchior, each represented a foreign group that the first Christian churches were founded in. One of them did represent the Pomegranates/Zoroastrians, though not all three.Enki wrote:The three wisemen were Zoroastrians as far as I could tell.
This is undoubtedly true. Anyone who denies the connection between contact of Zoroastrian ideas with the west and the rise of teleological/apocalyptic theology among the Jews has personal reasons for doing so, IMO.Ibrahim wrote:Thinking a little more on this subject, I was considering that Achaemenid Persia probably rates as the greatest ancient empire after the Romans ("great" in terms of wealth, size, stability, culture, and excluding all the ugly dirty bits of empire building), and nobody would ever dispute that the Romans continue to influence many aspects of Western (and some non-Western) culture to this day. Political influence is unmistakable, and there is certainly no question that Roman culture influenced the early development of Christianity.
To claim then that Persian culture, and its then-official state religion, would not likewise influence surrounding peoples to an extent that was still detectable seems unreasonable.
None of this is to say anything about the desirability of either empire or their influences, only that such influences clearly exist.
Juggernaut Nihilism wrote:. . Anyone who denies the connection between contact of Zoroastrian ideas with the west and the rise of teleological/apocalyptic theology among the Jews has personal reasons for doing so, IMO.
Marcus wrote:Juggernaut Nihilism wrote:. . Anyone who denies the connection between contact of Zoroastrian ideas with the west and the rise of teleological/apocalyptic theology among the Jews has personal reasons for doing so, IMO.
Unless, of course, Zorastrianism and Judaism both drew upon a deeper bullshit yet . . but there might be personal reasons for denying that as well . .
Chaldean, of course.Marcus wrote:Unless, of course, Zorastrianism and Judaism both drew upon a deeper magic yet
YMix wrote:Chaldean, of course.Marcus wrote:Unless, of course, Zorastrianism and Judaism both drew upon a deeper magic yet
Only on Halloween . . .YMix wrote:Chaldean, of course.Marcus wrote:Unless, of course, Zorastrianism and Judaism both drew upon a deeper magic yet
Farcus wrote:YMix wrote:Chaldean, of course.Marcus wrote:Unless, of course, Zorastrianism and Judaism both drew upon a deeper magic yet
The Eternal Word of God
Marcus wrote:Farcus wrote:YMix wrote:Chaldean, of course.Marcus wrote:Unless, of course, Zorastrianism and Judaism both drew upon a deeper magic yet
The Eternal Lack of Information
- *I suck.
I was afraid of that . . had you briefly off "Ignore." Back you go where you can roll your turd-balls out of sight.Farcus wrote:I can buy that.Marcus wrote:You sure you want to play lavender-games by altering quotes?
Marcus wrote:I was afraid of that . . had you briefly off "Ignore." Back you go where you can roll your turd-balls out of sight.Farcus wrote:I can buy that.Marcus wrote:*I suck.
PM me if and when you ever grow up, and I'l take you off "Ignore."
THAT'S RACIS.... oh, no wait. We cool, we cool.Juggernaut Nihilism wrote:This is undoubtedly true. Anyone who denies the connection between contact of Zoroastrian ideas with the west and the rise of teleological/apocalyptic theology among the Jews has personal reasons for doing so, IMO.Ibrahim wrote:Thinking a little more on this subject, I was considering that Achaemenid Persia probably rates as the greatest ancient empire after the Romans ("great" in terms of wealth, size, stability, culture, and excluding all the ugly dirty bits of empire building), and nobody would ever dispute that the Romans continue to influence many aspects of Western (and some non-Western) culture to this day. Political influence is unmistakable, and there is certainly no question that Roman culture influenced the early development of Christianity.
To claim then that Persian culture, and its then-official state religion, would not likewise influence surrounding peoples to an extent that was still detectable seems unreasonable.
None of this is to say anything about the desirability of either empire or their influences, only that such influences clearly exist.
In either case the various major cultures/religions would have influenced the expression of whatever Natural Law or true religion one might believe in. E.g. there is a true religion we will call Ur Religion. Ur Religion is true and eternal, but throughout history forms of worship and customs change in response to different cultures. Thus, in the Roman era Latin becomes the language of the priests of the Ur Religion, and non-Ur Religion terms and concepts of Roman origin are incorporated into the rituals and practices of the Ur Religion.Marcus wrote:Unless, of course, Zorastrianism and Judaism both drew upon a deeper magic yet . . but there might be personal reasons for denying that as well . .
I have read that Zoroaster/Zarathustra was ethnically Chaldean. Though the "official" religion of the Chaldeans was the Mesopotamian polytheism of the Babylonians that has held sway in various forms since the time of the Sumerians, or at least Sargon of Akkad. Zoroaster, as a Medized Chaldean, was himself an example of cultural influences on religion!YMix wrote:Chaldean, of course.
I had taken you off "ignore" as well, and it would seem from your post above that we're fairly close with the possible exception of the change noted in bold above.Ibrahim wrote:In either case the various major cultures/religions would have [manifested] the expression of whatever Natural Law or true religion one might believe in. E.g. there is a true religion we will call Ur Religion. Ur Religion is true and eternal, but throughout history forms of worship and customs change in response to different cultures. Thus, in the Roman era Latin becomes the language of the priests of the Ur Religion, and non-Ur Religion terms and concepts of Roman origin are incorporated into the rituals and practices of the Ur Religion.Marcus wrote:Unless, of course, Zorastrianism and Judaism both drew upon a deeper magic yet . . but there might be personal reasons for denying that as well . .
That's new to me, but not surprising.Ibrahim wrote:I have read that Zoroaster/Zarathustra was ethnically Chaldean.
In my view religion is simply the way people try to explain what they can't explain in a scientific manner. And therefore it tends to change as our knowledge of the universe increases. That doesn't mean that religious beliefs - such as the existence of God, of the soul or the prevalence of our conscience beyond physical death - are necessarily false. One day we may come to prove that all that is true by recourse to science. Religion is useful in as much as it allows us to have answers for things we can't prove. Our mind doesn't like blank spaces, so we fill them up as well as we can. What I dislike in religion is fanaticism, intolerance of other people's beliefs, and the attempt at manipulation of people's lives by the clergy. There can only be a religion where there is ignorance. It is thus not surprising that in the Old Testament Man was forbidden to eat from the tree of life and from the tree of knowledge...Ibrahim wrote:In either case the various major cultures/religions would have influenced the expression of whatever Natural Law or true religion one might believe in. E.g. there is a true religion we will call Ur Religion. Ur Religion is true and eternal, but throughout history forms of worship and customs change in response to different cultures. Thus, in the Roman era Latin becomes the language of the priests of the Ur Religion, and non-Ur Religion terms and concepts of Roman origin are incorporated into the rituals and practices of the Ur Religion.Marcus wrote:Unless, of course, Zorastrianism and Judaism both drew upon a deeper magic yet . . but there might be personal reasons for denying that as well . .
. . and the final appeal in every case, without exception, will be "Because that's what I believe."noddy wrote:ask "why" until the other persons brain pops.
