On the Nature of Things | Forum

Heracleum Persicum wrote: ↑Thu Mar 07, 2024 6:48 am

Typhoon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 07, 2024 4:29 am SCMP | Ex-Google engineer Linwei Ding charged with stealing AI secrets to aid Chinese companies

Typical.

Sour Grapes anti China Mccarthyism




China leading US in AI, way ahead of US




Harvard
Why China has edge on AI
what ancient emperors tell us about Xi Jinping



https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... ckout=true


https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/Dataw ... I-research


https://www.reuters.com/technology/chin ... 023-03-02/


Why should China spy on Google AI when China leading in AI

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If you knew anything about bibliometric analysis, you'd know not to rely on a single study.

Anyways, have you been living under a rock?

The current trend in ML [AI] is generative AI. In this field US researchers are completely dominant.

Heracleum Persicum wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2024 10:21 pm .

Nvidia deflating ..

China, Huawei and others have equivalent semi for AI

And

There not yet any killer application for Ai chips, to sell in mass

Nvidia could fall to $ 1+ Trillion cap , a 54% retreat from today's close, to 400 $/share

This a classic Wall Street crook SCAM, pump Semi stocks to absurd highs, dump it on Idi*ts, and, start pumping next struggling sector.

My guess is, energy will now be bought.

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This is silly. You really should consult a specialist about that premature celebration.

Nvidia is completely dominant in the ML sector. No one else has anything close to their GPUs.
Certainly not Huawei or any other Chinese company.

Sure, the current "AI" hype is completely over the top and Nvidia stock is absurdly overpriced,
but that does not mean that Nvidia is not a solid company.

Also, aside from "AI", GPUs are now essential for many other types of scientific computing important to the progress of an advanced economy.

Typhoon wrote: ↑Sat Mar 09, 2024 4:58 am

Heracleum Persicum wrote: ↑Fri Mar 08, 2024 10:21 pm .

Nvidia deflating ..

China, Huawei and others have equivalent semi for AI

And

There not yet any killer application for Ai chips, to sell in mass

Nvidia could fall to $ 1+ Trillion cap , a 54% retreat from today's close, to 400 $/share

This a classic Wall Street crook SCAM, pump Semi stocks to absurd highs, dump it on Idi*ts, and, start pumping next struggling sector.

My guess is, energy will now be bought.

.

Sure, the current "AI" hype is completely over the top and Nvidia stock is absurdly overpriced,
but that does not mean that Nvidia is not a solid company.

Also, aside from "AI", GPUs are now essential for many other types of scientific computing important to the progress of an advanced economy.

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$ 1 Trillion market cap no chicken feed ..

IMVHO any (pretty much all tech companies) US company market cap over $ 1 Trillion is "pumped" and in balloon state, and prime candidate for major retreat.

Don't forget, very difficult for tech product and companies to "stay on top" for long, shelf life limited .. AMD's stock price was $3 on March, 2020 .. Intel, blue blood chip, now struggling.

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Typhoon wrote: ↑Sat Mar 09, 2024 4:53 am

Heracleum Persicum wrote: ↑Thu Mar 07, 2024 6:48 am

Typhoon wrote: ↑Thu Mar 07, 2024 4:29 am SCMP | Ex-Google engineer Linwei Ding charged with stealing AI secrets to aid Chinese companies

Typical.

Sour Grapes anti China Mccarthyism




China leading US in AI, way ahead of US




Harvard
Why China has edge on AI
what ancient emperors tell us about Xi Jinping



https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... ckout=true


https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/Dataw ... I-research


https://www.reuters.com/technology/chin ... 023-03-02/


Why should China spy on Google AI when China leading in AI

.

If you knew anything about bibliometrics analysis, you'd know not to rely on a single study.

Anyways, have you been living under a rock?

The current trend in ML [AI] is generative AI. In this field US researchers are completely dominant.

Have to admit no expert in the field, but quite interested in .. all these are "machine learning" leveraging deep-learning models ..

Looked into this 5 yrs ago, but gave up

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https://www.ft.com/content/58bb9713-2d7 ... 213907491b

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DAVID P. GOLDMAN AND UWE PARPART
China has a plan,
and it’s working

China’s leadership focused single-mindedly on the transformation of Chinese industry through new technologies. It asks for and will give no quarter to America’s technology blockade, relying on an “all-country effort” to achieve self-sufficiency in semiconductors and other key technologies.

China thinks long term , not quarters or a year or four

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Heracleum Persicum wrote: ↑Fri Mar 15, 2024 12:04 am .
DAVID P. GOLDMAN AND UWE PARPART
China has a plan,
and it’s working

China’s leadership focused single-mindedly on the transformation of Chinese industry through new technologies. It asks for and will give no quarter to America’s technology blockade, relying on an “all-country effort” to achieve self-sufficiency in semiconductors and other key technologies.

China thinks long term , not quarters or a year or four

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The "Wiley Orientals who think in terms of centuries" myth is right up there with the "Noble Savage" myth in the West.

The usual pundits said the same about Japan Inc. during the Bubble Economy years.

In retrospect, it turned out that the Japan MITI, held by Western pundits to engage in strategic "long term" thinking was no better at picking industrial winners than any other govt bureaucracy. Nothing stifles innovation like central planning.

The same applies to PR China. PR China's former rapid progress was not due the CCP, but despite it. Deng unleashed the innate entrepreneurial spirits of the Chinese. Xi is stifling them - it's just Chinese history repeating.

My prediction is that Xi is the best thing that could have happened from the perspective of the West and Japan.

https://www.semafor.com/article/03/15/2 ... ier-warned

Domestic AI firms are said to rely excessively on Meta’s Llama system: an open source family of large language models (LLMs) that developers used to train AI services such as ChatGPT and its competitors.

Meanwhile, United States export restrictions on semiconductor technology to China mean that firms have struggled to create chips powerful enough to support domestic LLMs that have the same training capabilities as Llama.

China is racing to compete with Silicon Valley for AI dominance internationally, while the government has underscored the importance of being self-reliant in science and technology — but tech leaders fear a widening gap with the United States.

its much easier when you steal western designs and dont need to do it yourself.

“A chatbot model trained only on vetted information encircled by China’s Great Firewall is unlikely to be as effective as a foreign competitor that draws on a wider and more diverse corpus of sources,” Beijing-based journalist Michael Schuman wrote for The Atlantic last year. Chinese researchers are well aware of the limitations they face. During the presentation in Beijing, Li was told that a unique challenge faced by Chinese LLMs is “quality content that is in line with facts”, the South China Morning Post reported — a euphemism for ensuring that training models stick closely to Chinese Communist Party-sanctioned information and ideology.

oh noes, out woking the wokes.

...

which isnt to say I dont think China will catch up but as someone inside the industry, most of the commentary so far has been comical

their is a tiny handful of engineers in both the chip design and chip manufacture world who are on the cutting edge, they are jealously protected, and anyone starting clean room is either going to be extremely lucky, or a decade behind for quite some time.

the only reason china is in the game at all is because the west freely gave them the technology and let them copy it.

now, those chips are being used to blow up westerners with Iranian and Russian drones.

we would have to be idiots to keep giving them technology.

noddy wrote: ↑Sun Mar 17, 2024 3:27 am

https://www.semafor.com/article/03/15/2 ... ier-warned


which isnt to say I dont think China will catch up but as someone inside the industry, most of the commentary so far has been comical

their is a tiny handful of engineers in both the chip design and chip manufacture world who are on the cutting edge, they are jealously protected, and anyone starting clean room is either going to be extremely lucky, or a decade behind for quite some time.

the only reason china is in the game at all is because the west freely gave them the technology and let them copy it.

now, those chips are being used to blow up westerners with Iranian and Russian drones.

we would have to be idiots to keep giving them technology.

.

Yes, interesting

The chip war US and West engaging with China is not about military applications chips.

The war is about "commercial" use chips .. Huawei smart phones, Chinese EV (wiping out Western competitors), Xiaomi Robot Vacuum, Xiaomi Robot cutting your lawn .. PLA using these chips just excuse

Huawei and Xiaomi looked at as enemy # 1

US, West, want to slow down China economic progress .. to weaken China and give time for West to have a chance to catch up.

Iranian and Russian garden-variety weapons use chips that can be bought from Radio Shack stores .. all legacy chips.

The issue with high end chips is the YIELD, to be able to produce in mass for low price, for commercial use .. military does not care about price and does not need big quantity, they can produce any sophisticated chip needed for very high end military application.

US has very high tech military stuff BUT can't stop Houthi .. what is the use of F-35 or hypersonic stuff in Yemen or Iran or Afghanistan and Iraq ?

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https://www.youtube.com/shorts/R88hs1_s334




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Trump invites Chinese to build US auto plants
Offers China the same deal Reagan gave Japan in the 1980s

Trump on March 18 invited Chinese automakers to build plants in the United States, offering China the same deal that Ronald Reagan extended to Japan in the 1980s.

Addressing Chinese leader Xi Jinping, Trump said, “You and I are friends.”

Trump smart and wise .. he knows better to join China than to confront China .. Wise move.

US companies should stop making cars .. let German, Japanese and Chinese companies do, they know better


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China and US battle, quietly but fiercely, on yet another tech front :
patent applications

According to 2023 UN data, Chinese inventors led in international patent applications for the second year running, posting some 14,000 more than the second-place US

Trend written on the wall .. in generation or two (could be 3), most patents will be from China, Russia, India and IRAN

Main loser will be Europe

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Heracleum Persicum wrote: ↑Tue Mar 26, 2024 2:55 am .


China and US battle, quietly but fiercely, on yet another tech front :
patent applications

According to 2023 UN data, Chinese inventors led in international patent applications for the second year running, posting some 14,000 more than the second-place US

Trend written on the wall .. in generation or two (could be 3), most patents will be from China, Russia, India and IRAN

Main loser will be Europe

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You really should have that premature celebration looked at by a specialist.
It seems to be getting worse.

Cogitations | The Rise and Fall of LGFVs

Part 1: How China's local government financing vehicles (LGFVs) became China's most complex economic challenge

山高皇帝遠 | 山高皇帝远 | The mountains are high and the Emperor is far away.

Maximum control and maximum freedom. Only an emperor without cloths can make it work.

In competative environments losers are essential. Without them no winners.

An admittedly very low res impression I have, is that in Chinese culture only winning is acceptible. To lose, to fail is deeply shameful and painful.

In the USA however, failures are also lessons learned while you try to be your best. Efforts themselves are considered heroic acts that lift the collective out of poverty. In China only winning is a desirable option, with centralized control a natural allie.

The ultimate example where losing is not an option is war. It qualifies as a chronic state of paranoia when it takes over all economic life, education and even culture.

FT | China’s capital markets activity falls to multi-decade lows

Mainland equity issuance is the worst on record this year in a sign of low investor confidence

Is this the way Africans are now getting back at their new colonizers by humiliating them at home in front of live camera's?? Looks like it

Their body language might be on purpose: "we are not bought or coerced, we do this as a friendly gesture to the CCP whome we deeply love and respect!"

African runners allow chinese to win.

Parodite wrote: ↑Tue Apr 16, 2024 8:35 am Is this the way Africans are now getting back at their new colonizers by humiliating them at home in front of live camera's?? Looks like it

Their body language might be on purpose: "we are not bought or coerced, we do this as a friendly gesture to the CCP whome we deeply love and respect!"

African runners allow chinese to win.

Recall watching the official PR China New Year show a couple of years ago.

The one skit that I distinctly remember was the one wherein Africans were played by Chinese actors in blackface and were portrayed as such "Yes, Mastah" buffoons that they would have made a Southern old-school racist redneck complain in outrage.

WSJ | China’s Overcapacity Is Already Backfiring

Excess investment in industry isn’t made up by trading partners, and it has domestic consequences

Rapid urbanization without proper infrastructure planning.

Nature | Nearly half of China’s major cities are sinking — some ‘rapidly’

Tens of millions of people in the country’s coastal lands might find their homes below sea level by 2120 owing to sinking and sea-level rise.

The ~ 3mm sea level rise is a red herring when the rate of sinking is 10mm per year.

"Tokyo slowed its sinking from a rapid 240 mm a year in the 1960s to about 10 mm a year in the early 2000s after passing laws that limited groundwater pumping."

In the same boat as coastal China if the findings and predictions of the article are accurate.

For comparison Manhattan is sinking by about 1.6mm per year.

"Shanghai is sinking and I don't know how to swim".

Once again, top-down command economic planning at work:

Economist | Why so many Chinese graduates cannot find work

[Mod question. Can others link to and read this online pdf version of the article?]

Yes, the jumpshare link is good. It drops the audio file, but that is not needed here.

Nonc Hilaire wrote: ↑Mon Apr 22, 2024 2:17 am Yes, the jumpshare link is good. It drops the audio file, but that is not needed here.

Thank you for confirming.

Yes, can see the pdf.


https://asialink.unimelb.edu.au/insight ... 0in%202000

China go pffft.

Barron's | PR China's property market can't heal - who is feeling the pain.

Off the front page financial news, but still a major ongoing problem.