Climate change and other predictions of Imminent Doom

[Typhoon]

. . .

- Here is the global mean land-ocean temperature during the last 130 years period:



. . .

Is it?

Probably the most extensive land based set of measuring stations the one currently maintained by the US NOAA: the USHCN (U.S. Historical Climatology Network)

Roy Spencer | Warming in the USHCN is mainly an artifact of adjustments

[Dr. Spencer, fyi, is one of the pioneers of analyzing satellite data to measure global temperature and a veteran of the debate on systematic errors in the data]

[Simple Minded]

I had a debate with James Hansen, the chief Climate scientist of NASA over the process of Isostatic rebound, my proposal was that it can accelerate, his that it's rate is static, my proposal has been proven correct. The validity of my proposal has devastating consequences as when the Ronne and Ross Ice shelves break away from Antarctica 30 exatons of Ice will just fall off meaning an incredible bout of accelerating Isostatic rebound. I think due to relativity the Lithosphere will be destabilised to such an extent it will invert leaving the Planet a molten ball.

This sounds bad...... I have no idea how a bunch of rednecks could light off big chunks of ice......

Unless of course the Earth really is flat and the ice shelves just slide off the edge....

[Simple Minded]

. . .

- Here is the global mean land-ocean temperature during the last 130 years period:



. . .

Is it?

Probably the most extensive land based set of measuring stations the one currently maintained by the US NOAA: the USHCN (U.S. Historical Climatology Network)

Roy Spencer | Warming in the USHCN is mainly an artifact of adjustments

[Dr. Spencer, fyi, is one of the pioneers of analyzing satellite data to measure global temperature and a veteran of the debate on systematic errors in the data]

I would love for someone to prove that the temperature of the Earth or Oceans can be measured accurately to within +/- 0.5 degree C, even using satelite technology. Of course, any data is questionable, especially on such an emotion laden subject. How would the proof be convincing? Seems a lot of faith is required, even before the computers are booted up.

I would have similar doubts about a person who measures their height with a 0-6" dial caliper with a least count of .001", and then claim they are 5 foot 10.656" +/- .010" tall..... or the paleontologist who finds a unknown tooth, and re-creates a 40 foot long skeleton of a previously unknown creature.

Scientists are also often people of faith.....

[Typhoon]

. . .

- Here is the global mean land-ocean temperature during the last 130 years period:



. . .

Is it?

Probably the most extensive land based set of measuring stations the one currently maintained by the US NOAA: the USHCN (U.S. Historical Climatology Network)

Roy Spencer | Warming in the USHCN is mainly an artifact of adjustments

[Dr. Spencer, fyi, is one of the pioneers of analyzing satellite data to measure global temperature and a veteran of the debate on systematic errors in the data]

I would love for someone to prove that the temperature of the Earth or Oceans can be measured accurately to within +/- 0.5 degree C, even using satelite technology. Of course, any data is questionable, especially on such an emotion laden subject. How would the proof be convincing? Seems a lot of faith is required, even before the computers are booted up.

I would have similar doubts about a person who measures their height with a 0-6" dial caliper with a least count of .001", and then claim they are 5 foot 10.656" +/- .010" tall..... or the paleontologist who finds a unknown tooth, and re-creates a 40 foot long skeleton of a previously unknown creature.

Quite right. The variation in the temperature in the room that I'm in is probably more than 0.5C from the floor to the ceiling.

That anyone can claim, with any seriousness, that we know what the global temperature was in 1890 to +/- 0.1C simply boggles the mind.

Scientists are also often people of faith.....

I think it's more a case of a mixture of hubris and ignorance than faith.
Failing to take into account and underestimating various sources of systematic error combined with an appalling lack of understanding of and/or willful misuse of statistics.

We've learned from experience that the truth will come out. Other experimenters will repeat your experiment and find out whether you were wrong or right. Nature's phenomena will agree or they'll disagree with your theory. And, although you may gain some temporary fame and excitement, you will not gain a good reputation as a scientist if you haven't tried to be very careful in this kind of work. And it's this type of integrity, this kind of care not to fool yourself, that is missing to a large extent in much of the research in cargo cult science.

~ R. P. Feynman | "Cargo Cult Science", adapted from a commencement address given at Caltech (1974)

Climate science, so-called, is the classic example of cargo cult science

[Carbizene]

... the ice shelves just slide off the edge....

Ice shelves don't slide, they float, your getting them mixed up with Ice sheets, apologies for my hubris.

[Simple Minded]

... the ice shelves just slide off the edge....

Ice shelves don't slide, they float, your getting them mixed up with Ice sheets, apologies for my hubris.

No apologies required bro! Just pondering 30 exatons of ice boggles my mind.

Would it knock the Earth off it's axis? Assuming it did not float of the edge......

Back to more scientific matters, what weighs more 30 exatons of bricks or 30 exatons of feathers?

Enquiring minds want to know!

[Simple Minded]

Quite right. The variation in the temperature in the room that I'm in is probably more than 0.5C from the floor to the ceiling

That anyone can claim, with any seriousness, that we know what the global temperature was in 1890 to +/- 0.1C simply boggles the mind..

I have often used similar examples with friends who are True Believers. "Let me see you measure the temperature inside your house to +/- 1 degrees C over 24 hours...... or even get 50 people to help you measure the temp of a square mile around your house....."

I doubt the ability exists even today to measure the temperature of Earth to +/- 2 degrees, yet alone the 0.1 degree C BS.

Scientists are also often people of faith.....

I think it's more a case of a mixture of hubris and ignorance than faith.
Failing to take into account and underestimating various sources of systematic error combined with an appalling lack of understanding of and/or willful misuse of statistics.

As a friend with a degree in economics says about Economists "the are a combination of alchemists and poker players!"

Paychecks have a lot to do with it. I probably posted this before but.... in the early/mid 1990s I had the pleasure of working with scientists whose mortgage payments depended on winning government contracts. NASA announced they found a meteorite from Mars that may contain fossils. Being a newbie, I asked the old pros "Claiming they know that meteorite is from Mars is the stupidest thing I ever heard. Anyone who gives it 30 seconds thought will know it is an unprovable assumption! Why would they risk credibility on such a unprovable claim?"

They laughed and said "NASA no one will give it any thought, they are just planting emotional seeds in congress and the public. In a few months or so, they will start publicizing their plans for missions to Mars. Get everyone emotionally invested and the money will flow."

[Carbizene]

No apologies required bro! Just pondering 30 exatons of ice boggles my mind.

Would it knock the Earth off it's axis? Assuming it did not float of the edge......

As there is no mass loss just even redistribution of mass from the Axis to over the surface area seems fair to expect no great perturbation though seeing as East Antarctica is to one side of the Axis and far larger than the Western portion some perturbation can be expected.

One thing I'm looking forward to in this process is the Super Volcano that erupts along the Transantarctic mountain range.



The map above illustrates just how large the Ronne and Ross ice shelves are thus how essential they are to the structural integrity of West Antarctica Ice sheet.

So when the WAIS falls off the land mass below pops up tearing the Lithosphere along the stress line defined by the Transantarctic mountain range creating a must see Super Volcano of a scale not seen since the Siberian traps event.

Back to more scientific matters, what weighs more 30 exatons of bricks or 30 exatons of feathers?

Enquiring minds want to know!

Everyone knows its bricks!

[Carbizene]

Bq4h9mViqpM

Patrick Michaels jumps ship.. " the Global warming is real and people have something to do with it..get over it"

[Typhoon]

Bq4h9mViqpM

Patrick Michaels jumps ship.. " the Global warming is real and people have something to do with it..get over it"

Who cares?

Claiming to be able to reconstruct global temperature to +/- 0.1C in 1890 is politics. It's certainly not science.

[Typhoon]

No apologies required bro! Just pondering 30 exatons of ice boggles my mind.

Would it knock the Earth off it's axis? Assuming it did not float of the edge......

As there is no mass loss just even redistribution of mass from the Axis to over the surface area seems fair to expect no great perturbation though seeing as East Antarctica is to one side of the Axis and far larger than the Western portion some perturbation can be expected.

An exaton is a large number compared to the ice cubes in one's refrigerator, but a small number compared to all the ice on our planet.

One thing I'm looking forward to in this process is the Super Volcano that erupts along the Transantarctic mountain range.



The map above illustrates just how large the Ronne and Ross ice shelves are thus how essential they are to the structural integrity of West Antarctica Ice sheet.

So when the WAIS falls off the land mass below pops up tearing the Lithosphere along the stress line defined by the Transantarctic mountain range creating a must see Super Volcano of a scale not seen since the Siberian traps event.

Purely speculative doomer porn.

[Carbizene]

Bq4h9mViqpM

Patrick Michaels jumps ship.. " the Global warming is real and people have something to do with it..get over it"

Who cares?

Claiming to be able to reconstruct global temperature to +/- 0.1C in 1890 is politics. It's certainly not science.

Hilarious...you never really liked him anyway..

Them Scientists don't know nuffin... the new Luddites eh?

[Carbizene]

An exaton is a large number compared to the ice cubes in one's refrigerator, but a small number compared to all the ice on our planet.

err... not really seeing as the Antarctic contains 90% of the ice on the Planet.

Purely speculative doomer porn.

Lame admonishment indicative of somebody disputing something they have no idea about.

[Simple Minded]

As there is no mass loss just even redistribution of mass from the Axis to over the surface area seems fair to expect no great perturbation though seeing as East Antarctica is to one side of the Axis and far larger than the Western portion some perturbation can be expected.

One thing I'm looking forward to in this process is the Super Volcano that erupts along the Transantarctic mountain range.



The map above illustrates just how large the Ronne and Ross ice shelves are thus how essential they are to the structural integrity of West Antarctica Ice sheet.

So when the WAIS falls off the land mass below pops up tearing the Lithosphere along the stress line defined by the Transantarctic mountain range creating a must see Super Volcano of a scale not seen since the Siberian traps event.

Cool map. How about ice shelf thickness? I remember 15? years ago, a chunk of ice approx 20 x 50 miles broke off. We joked about colonizing the slab, establishing an offshore tax free country until it melted, would have made billions of $.

Is the theory that once the ice shelves are gone, the loss of mass on top of the volcano creates a weak spot prone to erruptions? Or like a glacier the resultant gouge weakens the "volcano cap?"

Doomer Porn? Wasn't he the lead singer for the Village People? Or a great name for a band....

[Typhoon]

Bq4h9mViqpM

Patrick Michaels jumps ship.. " the Global warming is real and people have something to do with it..get over it"

Who cares?

Claiming to be able to reconstruct global temperature to +/- 0.1C in 1890 is politics. It's certainly not science.

Hilarious...you never really liked him anyway..

Them Scientists don't know nuffin... the new Luddites eh?

Cargo cult pseudoscience is not science.

[Carbizene]

Cool map. How about ice shelf thickness?

2500 m

I remember 15? years ago, a chunk of ice approx 20 x 50 miles broke off. We joked about colonizing the slab, establishing an offshore tax free country until it melted, would have made billions of $.

When it melts just jump on another one.

Is the theory that once the ice shelves are gone, the loss of mass on top of the volcano creates a weak spot prone to erruptions? Or like a glacier the resultant gouge weakens the "volcano cap?"

The weight of ice up to 2.5 k's thick pushes down the mantle, when the Ice falls off the mantle bounces up in a proven phenomenon called Isostatic rebound, this has been proven to cause increased Volcanism and magma production.

Doomer Porn? Wasn't he the lead singer for the Village People? Or a great name for a band....

Typhoon is the lead singer.

[Carbizene]

Cargo cult pseudoscience is not science.

yeah those crazy cats at NASA are always getting mixed up in all sorts of wacky lavender like the whole faked moon landing thing.

And all those Academic bodies around the planet, in fact every single relevant one is always getting sucked in to wacky ideas.

[Typhoon]

Cargo cult pseudoscience is not science.

yeah those crazy cats at NASA are always getting mixed up in all sorts of wacky lavender like the whole faked moon landing thing.

Misdirection. Only the Hansen gang at the GISS is involved in cooking up global temperature data.

And all those Academic bodies around the planet, in fact every single relevant one is always getting sucked in to wacky ideas.

Appeal to authority. Not a scientific argument.

Also the track record of experts in predicting the future is as poor as that of anyone else. Often worse due to an excess of hubris.

[Typhoon]

. . .

The weight of ice up to 2.5 k's thick pushes down the mantle, when the Ice falls off the mantle bounces up in a proven phenomenon called Isostatic rebound, this has been proven to cause increased volcanism and magma production.

. . .

Not even wrong.

[Typhoon]

An exaton is a large number compared to the ice cubes in one's refrigerator, but a small number compared to all the ice on our planet.

err... not really seeing as the Antarctic contains 90% of the ice on the Planet.

Except that the Antarctic is not melting.

[Carbizene]

. . .

The weight of ice up to 2.5 k's thick pushes down the mantle, when the Ice falls off the mantle bounces up in a proven phenomenon called Isostatic rebound, this has been proven to cause increased volcanism and magma production.

. . .

Not even wrong.

How?

[Carbizene]

An exaton is a large number compared to the ice cubes in one's refrigerator, but a small number compared to all the ice on our planet.

err... not really seeing as the Antarctic contains 90% of the ice on the Planet.

Except that the Antarctic is not melting.

I like how you don't admit you are wrong about Antarcticas ice volume and move on to change the focus.

Antarctica is collapsing, over the last thirty years permanent Ice shelves have started breaking off.

[Typhoon]

An exaton is a large number compared to the ice cubes in one's refrigerator, but a small number compared to all the ice on our planet.

err... not really seeing as the Antarctic contains 90% of the ice on the Planet.

Except that the Antarctic is not melting.

I like how you don't admit you are wrong about Antarcticas ice volume and move on to change the focus.

Antarctica is collapsing, over the last thirty years permanent Ice shelves have started breaking off.

Ice shelves are always flowing out to the sea and breaking up: calving



We went through this same exercise years ago: what % of the total ice in the Antarctic does one of the ice shelves constitute?

The Antarctic is not "melting".

[Carbizene]

Glaciologists say the permanent ice shelves are collapsing, take it up with them if you don't agree.

The Ronne and the Ross are of a size that makes them significant to the structural integrity of the entire WAIS, should they break off, say as a result of rapid warming induced by 1.3 teratons of Methane the entire WAIS falls off rapidly into the sea.

The issue is not Antarctic melting but collapsing due to the stabilising influence of Ice shelves snapping off and floating away.

[Typhoon]

Glaciologists say the permanent ice shelves are collapsing, take it up with them if you don't agree.

The only thing permanent about ice shelves is their constant flow into the sea and breakup.

The Ronne and the Ross are of a size that makes them significant to the structural integrity of the entire WAIS, should they break off, say as a result of rapid warming induced by 1.3 teratons of Methane the entire WAIS falls off rapidly into the sea.

And if your grandmother had bollocks she'd be your grandfather.

The issue is not Antarctic melting but collapsing due to the stabilising influence of Ice shelves snapping off and floating away.

Any day now . . .