Republican POTUS Candidates

[Typhoon]

Gallup Poll

[Carbizene]

Diferent numbers in Iowa

[Ibrahim]

A sample of scanned racist, homophobic, anti-Semitic, or just silly articles from the Ron Paul newsletter can be found here:

http://www.mrdestructo.com/2011/12/game ... .html#more


Interestingly they span 33 years, bear Paul's name, and maintain consistent voice throughout.

[Typhoon]

A sample of scanned racist, homophobic, anti-Semitic, or just silly articles from the Ron Paul newsletter can be found here:

http://www.mrdestructo.com/2011/12/game ... .html#more


Interestingly they span 33 years, bear Paul's name, and maintain consistent voice throughout.

Boy, it sure burns me to have a national holiday for that pro-communist philanderer, Martin Luther King. I voted against this outrage time and time again as a Congressman. What an infamy that Ronald Reagan approved it! We can thank him for our annual Hate Whitey Day. Listen to a black radio talk show in any major city. The racial hatred makes a KKK rally look tame."

RP is on the mark regarding black talk radio. Recall listening, out of curiousity, while driving to such radio shows in the MIdwest,

"The racial hatred makes a KKK rally look tame." was an accurate description.

[Enki]

People like to give the anti-white racism a pass because of historical and present imbalances, but it's not good and it's not healthy regardless of where it comes from.

[cincinnatus]

A sample of scanned racist, homophobic, anti-Semitic, or just silly articles from the Ron Paul newsletter can be found here:

http://www.mrdestructo.com/2011/12/game ... .html#more


Interestingly they span 33 years, bear Paul's name, and maintain consistent voice throughout.

I guess that means Obama will win 99.9% of the "Black" vote, instead of the usual 97%.

[cincinnatus]

Posted from Diegetics board from yesterday:

Mr. Perfect wrote:No, I'm trying to change your mind. You do more harm than good. I'm trying to get you back from the darkside.

So Mr. P., if tomorrow you woke up and found that all Demopublicans has miraculously vanished from the USA, then everything would be fine?

The problem with binary views, such as the the Demopublicans are the cause of all problems in the US, is that they go against empirical observation and
does, in my view, more harm than good to your cause. It's a cartoon, not reality, and the reaction to it is naturally one of skepticism.

I'm no fan of POTUS Obama, however, the current crop of Republicrat POTUS candidates is a depressing lot: from dangerous crazy Bachmann, to dumber than a bag of bricks Perry, to executive hair Romney, and on to rank opportunist Gingrich. All of whom make even Japanese politicians look good by comparison, which is not easily done, I can assure you.

All, with the notable exception of Paul, are platitude spouting war mongers, catering to religious extremists, eager to attack, for example, Iran.

I think that it is telling that the one rational - sensible constitutionalist candidate, Paul, is consistently marginalized by both the main stream media and his own party.

Apparently Paul is currently leading in the Iowa something or other.

I would consider it nothing short of miraculous if Paul was elected POTUS and I think it would make for a most interesting and memorable admin.

I wonder which will be harder for me to pull off...voting for Paul for POTUS, or crafting a flawless fake Col Sun American birth certificate (say, Chicago, Illinois, as you've stated you lived there), kidnapping and hypnotizing you from Japan, and having you run as a sensible alternative to the R&D Dumb and Dumber marathon? I tried sincere praise, flattery, and even begging...now I'm moving into felony territory. Col Sun in 2012!!!!!

[Azrael]

Diferent numbers in Iowa

There's an anybody-but-Romney contingent, but they still haven't gotten their acts together. There's probably also an anybody-but-Paul contingent, due to his defense and foreign policy views, which are way outside of what's considered acceptable by most Republican primary voters. It would be odd if Romney captured Iowa with less than a third of the vote. He'd be in relatively good shape, considering he'll win NH, but would still be very vulnerable if someone else (and not Paul either) won in SC.

BTW: I actually like Ron Paul. I like John Huntsman and Gary Johnson, too, but neither of them will win a single state, with the possible exception of Utah for Huntsman and New Mexico for Johnson.

I'm afraid Republicans hoping to stop Romney will give up and allow him to walk away with the nomination. Then it will be a boring race.

[Ibrahim]

A sample of scanned racist, homophobic, anti-Semitic, or just silly articles from the Ron Paul newsletter can be found here:

http://www.mrdestructo.com/2011/12/game ... .html#more


Interestingly they span 33 years, bear Paul's name, and maintain consistent voice throughout.

I guess that means Obama will win 99.9% of the "Black" vote, instead of the usual 97%.

Well, Jews and homosexuals might not care for his remarks about them, and Latinos might also look twice at the concerns over "race war." How many points does a candidate want to give away?

Also, some white heterosexuals might think it makes him look like a nut.

RP is on the mark regarding black talk radio. Recall listening, out of curiousity, while driving to such radio shows in the MIdwest,

"The racial hatred makes a KKK rally look tame." was an accurate description.

So there is some wheat among the chaff?

I willing to bet you are correct about black talk radio being bad. I'm sure its true of Latino talk radio, only I don't speak Spanish and couldn't confirm. Come to think of it, talk radio is where hateful people of every stripe go to vent. Also argue about sports.

[cincinnatus]

A sample of scanned racist, homophobic, anti-Semitic, or just silly articles from the Ron Paul newsletter can be found here:

http://www.mrdestructo.com/2011/12/game ... .html#more


Interestingly they span 33 years, bear Paul's name, and maintain consistent voice throughout.

I guess that means Obama will win 99.9% of the "Black" vote, instead of the usual 97%.

Well, Jews and homosexuals might not care for his remarks about them, and Latinos might also look twice at the concerns over "race war." How many points does a candidate want to give away?

Also, some white heterosexuals might think it makes him look like a nut.

RP is on the mark regarding black talk radio. Recall listening, out of curiousity, while driving to such radio shows in the MIdwest,

"The racial hatred makes a KKK rally look tame." was an accurate description.

So there is some wheat among the chaff?

I willing to bet you are correct about black talk radio being bad. I'm sure its true of Latino talk radio, only I don't speak Spanish and couldn't confirm. Come to think of it, talk radio is where hateful people of every stripe go to vent. Also argue about sports.

If Tinker is correct about the Occupy crowd, Paul might pick them up on the anti-empire/war sentiment. At this point, if any other Repub wins, or if Obama wins, it's pretty much a done deal we'll get an idiotic war with Iran. R. Paul, if he is able to win and then control the bureaucracy, seems to be the only politician in the U.S. that would prevent that outcome. Just like lots of folks took Obama for his word that he didn't hear anti-everybody but African-American rhetoric at Wright's church, I'd bet a large swath will hope that RP didn't/doesn't believe that lavender and will pull the lever. I mean, what's the worst that can happen? A POTUS Paul appointed AG who uses the Dept of Justice to take care of "his people?"

[Azrael]

A sample of scanned racist, homophobic, anti-Semitic, or just silly articles from the Ron Paul newsletter can be found here:

http://www.mrdestructo.com/2011/12/game ... .html#more


Interestingly they span 33 years, bear Paul's name, and maintain consistent voice throughout.

I guess that means Obama will win 99.9% of the "Black" vote, instead of the usual 97%.

Pretty much. And in the primaries, those tracts may actually help Ron Paul.

[Ibrahim]

I guess that means Obama will win 99.9% of the "Black" vote, instead of the usual 97%.

Well, Jews and homosexuals might not care for his remarks about them, and Latinos might also look twice at the concerns over "race war." How many points does a candidate want to give away?

Also, some white heterosexuals might think it makes him look like a nut.

RP is on the mark regarding black talk radio. Recall listening, out of curiousity, while driving to such radio shows in the MIdwest,

"The racial hatred makes a KKK rally look tame." was an accurate description.

So there is some wheat among the chaff?

I willing to bet you are correct about black talk radio being bad. I'm sure its true of Latino talk radio, only I don't speak Spanish and couldn't confirm. Come to think of it, talk radio is where hateful people of every stripe go to vent. Also argue about sports.

If Tinker is correct about the Occupy crowd, Paul might pick them up on the anti-empire/war sentiment.

Well this is one of the points the blogger was making. Ron Paul has some good ideas, but also many crazy ones. People who might like those ideas will also be repelled by the others. Going even further, idealistic people might not want to reward the cynical race hustling of the newsletters with political success on other merits.

At this point, if any other Repub wins, or if Obama wins, it's pretty much a done deal we'll get an idiotic war with Iran.

I don't think so. At most, Israel will get carte blanche to launch air strikes (which they would do without it if they wanted) but America is not up for another war, and I think the politicians are getting that message from Americans generally, and from the generals telling them that the military needs a time out. And the economy, of course.

But, for what it's worth, Paul is correct in opposing military confrontation with Iran.

Just like lots of folks took Obama for his word that he didn't hear anti-everybody but African-American rhetoric at Wright's church, I'd bet a large swath will hope that RP didn't/doesn't believe that lavender and will pull the lever.

I think its fair to raise the Wright issue in comparison, but I do think it would be more accurate if, instead of comparing Obama to Paul in this instance, one compared Paul to Wright himself.

[crashtech]

I suppose if there was clarity over the authorship of those articles, that case could be made, though I'm not sure anything in the newsletters rises to the level of "G*d Damn America!"

[Enki]

People who would never vote for him anyway won't vote for him because of the letters. Whatever. it's more important that he debate Obama than he actually win.

[Ibrahim]

I suppose if there was clarity over the authorship of those articles, that case could be made, though I'm not sure anything in the newsletters rises to the level of "G*d Damn America!"

I think some of the content is considerably worse, actually. But you're right, the authorship is disputed. This allows for the possibility that Ron Paul just allowed a racist/homophobic newsletter to be published in his name without his knowledge or consent for decades, rather than actually writing it.

People who would never vote for him anyway won't vote for him because of the letters.

Certainly its all fun and games to people who weren't going to vote for him anyway, but aren't there any Paul supporters out there who might see this stuff and think twice?

[Enki]

Certainly its all fun and games to people who weren't going to vote for him anyway, but aren't there any Paul supporters out there who might see this stuff and think twice?

I don't find it compelling. As I see it. 'So what if he is a racist?' Lets take a look at it as though he is a racist, say we believe it's true, so what? The reason why is because he would do more to end the most racist policies in America than any other candidate. So even if he is personally a racist, his ideology doesn't even take race into account. He wants the law to be truly agnostic on the concept of race. He'd end the drug war which is the most racist policy we have in this country. Fewer black people would be harassed by cops, fewer black people would go to prison. So what if he won't let a black man marry his daughter? The result of a Ron Paul Presidency would make the United States a less racist country than a Barack Obama Presidency.

[crashtech]

If Paul's opponents did a compilation of the alleged quotes that they believe to be "smoking guns," this could possibly change some minds. I'm a fairly inquisitive guy, but wading through all that 99.99% innocuous old news is just too boring and time consuming, and I would bet I am not alone.

[Typhoon]

Economist | Flirting with fratricide

A sudden departure from civility could damage the Republicans in 2012

THEY call it Ronald Reagan’s 11th commandment: never speak ill of a fellow Republican. For much of 2011 Republican contenders for the presidential nomination tried to keep the commandment at least half in mind. During the long sequence of televised debates they have made sure to smile and smile, even while shooting villainous little darts at one another. In mid-December, however, after Newt Gingrich sped ahead of Mitt Romney to become the front-runner, the darts turned into bullets. Each man is now doing his best to shoot gaping holes in the other’s reputation. For the embattled presidency of Barack Obama, this is Christmas come early.

Will the Republicrats snatch defeat from the jaws of victory?

Will POTUS Obama have received a gift for all seasons from the Republicrats for Christmas 2012?

[cincinnatus]

Certainly its all fun and games to people who weren't going to vote for him anyway, but aren't there any Paul supporters out there who might see this stuff and think twice?

I don't find it compelling. As I see it. 'So what if he is a racist?' Lets take a look at it as though he is a racist, say we believe it's true, so what? The reason why is because he would do more to end the most racist policies in America than any other candidate. So even if he is personally a racist, his ideology doesn't even take race into account. He wants the law to be truly agnostic on the concept of race. He'd end the drug war which is the most racist policy we have in this country. Fewer black people would be harassed by cops, fewer black people would go to prison. So what if he won't let a black man marry his daughter? The result of a Ron Paul Presidency would make the United States a less racist country than a Barack Obama Presidency.

My utter disappointment (as in using the Dept of Justice to settle scores, vice "healing the racial divide) in Holder as the AG is the singular reason why I won't vote for Obama under any circumstances. Add in the gun-running lavender...that dude is a f-ing disgrace. Maybe, MAYBE, if Bachman is the Repub nominee, I'll vote Obama out of sheer self-preservation, but that's about it.

Other beefs with the current admin:
I disagree fundamentally with the lack of concern for even asking for congressional approval for Libya, the lying to the American public saying "we're just in a support role, not actively bombing" while I was looking at the daily battle damage assessments from the AFRICOM then NATO targeting shops. His Obamacare/Romneycare thing would be called a corporate shill program to help health insurance companies if a Repub had pushed it (yes, I understand the votes weren't there for a pure socialized medicine program, but he should have held out for the government option). His wife is literally an American Michelle Antoinette with the vacations. Slashing DoD while ramping up potential and actual responsibilities with the "Global Commons" concept takes away the positive he gets for finally pulling out of Iraq. His Sec Defs have been pretty good though. I think Hillary has been good as Sec State (albeit, hampered by indecision at the top over Iranian protests in 20010 and Egypt in 2011). I don't see any of the Republican field doing better on Def or geostrategy, so overall FP for me is a wash between the two parties (with the singular exception of RP). Of course, now Trump is talking a 3rd party run, which will siphon a few percentage points away from the GOP, ensuring a 44% to 40% win for Obama. I guess I'll get the "honor" of briefing the SecDef when the balloon goes up over Iran as I move to my new job at the Pentagon next year.

[crashtech]

I think you could leave out the part about the First Lady (sounds a bit petty to me), but I am in agreement with you otherwise.

[cincinnatus]

I think you could leave out the part about the First Lady (sounds a bit petty to me), but I am in agreement with you otherwise.

Fair enough. In truth, she's complicated. On one hand, she does quite well with support to military families, appears to be a solid parent...the other is the weird expensive multiple vacations. Probably nitpicking on my part (nothing on the sheer WTF scale as Barbara Bush not wanting to talk about the bloodshed of American forces in the war her son started). Overall, it's tied to the critique of the "limousine liberal" thing.

[crashtech]

I think you could leave out the part about the First Lady (sounds a bit petty to me), but I am in agreement with you otherwise.

Fair enough. In truth, she's complicated. On one hand, she does quite well with support to military families, appears to be a solid parent...the other is the weird expensive multiple vacations. Probably nitpicking on my part (nothing on the sheer WTF scale as Barbara Bush not wanting to talk about the bloodshed of American forces in the war her son started). Overall, it's tied to the critique of the "limousine liberal" thing.

I appreciate your acceptance of my criticism. Much of the time, we unconsciously argue just to be right, or to exert dominance. But there are rare moments of persuasive argumentation, which to me is the most compelling reason to be here.

Since I consider you an excellent spokesman for your point of view (with which I find much agreement), I naturally want your opinions to be as persuasive as possible. Perceived attacks against any First Family are unlikely to be helpful in this regard.

[cincinnatus]

I think you could leave out the part about the First Lady (sounds a bit petty to me), but I am in agreement with you otherwise.

Fair enough. In truth, she's complicated. On one hand, she does quite well with support to military families, appears to be a solid parent...the other is the weird expensive multiple vacations. Probably nitpicking on my part (nothing on the sheer WTF scale as Barbara Bush not wanting to talk about the bloodshed of American forces in the war her son started). Overall, it's tied to the critique of the "limousine liberal" thing.

I appreciate your acceptance of my criticism. Much of the time, we unconsciously argue just to be right, or to exert dominance. But there are rare moments of persuasive argumentation, which to me is the most compelling reason to be here.

Since I consider you an excellent spokesman for your point of view (with which I find much agreement), I naturally want your opinions to be as persuasive as possible. Perceived attacks against any First Family are unlikely to be helpful in this regard.

I'll take all the help I can get! One counter though...likeability matters in politics. It's just one minor annoyance I have towards their "likeability." Not an important issue or policy concern, just a matter of "optics" as the President's people and journalists like to say. Notice, I didn't critique the right's harping on the golf thing with Obama...reason is it doesn't cost us a dime whether he's in the Oval office or on the links. Not so much with the vacations though...

Personally, why I keep coming back to this group of people I've never really met is FOR THE MOST PART, we can have civil yet divisive discussions and accept honest disagreement. In real life, that's sometimes difficult, especially on matters of politics, religion, culture and history.

Oh, and there are some really smart and eloquent folks from across the globe who "speak" at this little Agora.

[crashtech]

Yeah, likeability matters too much in politics. The best leaders of the past always seemed to have a bit of the a-hole in them, I wish we could get back to looking at real leadership qualities instead of who we would want over for dinner.

I too appreciate the cosmopolitan nature of the posts here. Since I find little time (or inclination ) to expand my admittedly provincial point of view, reading comments with a more global view is good medicine for me.

[Enki]

If Paul's opponents did a compilation of the alleged quotes that they believe to be "smoking guns," this could possibly change some minds. I'm a fairly inquisitive guy, but wading through all that 99.99% innocuous old news is just too boring and time consuming, and I would bet I am not alone.

If you really want to, I can get you a lot of stuff. It's pretty horrendous actually. It's totally smoking gun territory for people who care about such things.

Like: Martin Luther King Jr was a communist pedophile.